Two boys - one Board of Review

[Quailman]

Last Monday, we had sixteen Boards of review scheduled, as the entire group of boys who crossed over in late February were ready for Tenderfoot BoRs, plus a couple of older scouts were advancing. I happened past the area where the BoRs were going on and noticed three committee members and two young scouts. I asked later and was told that it was done to facilitate them and get them all done without being there all night. There were two panels of three committee members doing twofers.

Am I wrong to feel that these boys were getting short-changed in the interest of changing the patch on their shirts? They wanted to get them all ranked up by the court of honor Monday.

[pipestone1991]

Am I wrong to feel that these boys were getting short-changed in the interest of changing the patch on their shirts? They wanted to get them all ranked up by the court of honor Monday.

This is difficult ....I think I'll leave this to the adults.

[smtroop168]

Short changed: Yes. What does this teach the boys? What if they asked Scout A about how things are going and Scout B sitting next to him was one he wanted to talk about?

Why not 4 or 8 at a time? Did the SM do the SMC as a group gaggle?

The BSA policy on BORs is mute on this probably because they figured no one would do more than 1 scout at the same BOR. ASM142 would say as he does in his posts "if it's not written down, it's not an official rule"

Is your committee related to my MB Sash "Geometric Pattern" Mom?

What does your District/Council Advancement Committee say?

[jr56]

Never heard of doing more than 1 boy at a time. A BOR is supposed to be confidential, a way to find out what each boy thinks. Doubling up defeats that purpose.

[joat]

Group boards of review fits in nicely with group rank signoffs and group merit badge classes. Kinda like a den.

[spl08]

I agree that it totally defeats the purpose. They can do them over the course of two meetings if need be, but that shouldn't be acceptable. There's really nothing you can do about it though other than maybe try to argue your point to the SPL.

Kinda like a den.

That alone says it shouldn't be done. These guys just crossed over from Cub Scouting, more than likely being told that Boy Scouting is whole other ball game and being told that they should be ready for that, becoming more independent and whatnot, and then all of the sudden they see that Boy Scouting sort of operates like Cub Scouting! What kind of message does that send? It would not surprise me if there were a scout or two who would be a little disappointed upon that realization.

[WVBeaver05]

When and Where to Hold a Board of Review
A board of review should be held where the board members and the Scout are the only ones aware of what is going on. There should be no possibility for embarrassing the Scout in front of others. And a Scout should be comfortable speaking his mind to the board.

(emphasis added)

Seems pretty clear cut. What was done was wrong.

I think the goal was admirable (get the Scouts' rank requirements completed before the COH). But the method was not.

What message did it send? The wrong one. "It's OK to break the rules when we have a good reason" Sorry. That doesn't cut it with me. It could be argued that Scouts this young don't know the rules about BOR. Probably true (sounds like some adults don't either). But that doesn't make it OK.

What would I have done when faced with this dilema? Probably stayed late or scheduled special meetings later in the week to get the requirements completed. Would it have been inconvenient? Sure it would. But it would also have been the write thing to do. And that would have been the message that was sent.

YiS

[lifescoutforlife]

Never heard of doing more than 1 boy at a time. A BOR is supposed to be confidential, a way to find out what each boy thinks. Doubling up defeats that purpose.

Ditto!

[evmori]

BOR's should never be done in a group.

[smtroop168]

I missed Wagion's BOR training post. I was looking at the link on BORs on meritbadge.org.

I particularly like spl08 analogy to Cubs as he is exactly right. We all spend a lot of time trying to break the Cub Scout - leader does everything mentality.

[Quailman]

When our SM took over the role, he had time commitment conflicts due to being a Cubmaster for a pack. He's also involved at the district level as an Assistant District Commissioner for packs. I think he had been a cubmaster for ten years. The Committee Chair told him he had to give that up, but it took six months to get a new CM in and let go. He's always run the troop. He calls it "boy led" but they don't do a thing that he doesn't tell them. I believe he's doing them a disservice, and I know we are losing boys who get frustrated.

He would rather plan for the boys to go to a lock-in at a local video gaming center than have them go on an orienteering weekend. We do fun things like swimming on campouts, but never work on scout skills. Maybe I'm being a bit harsh - when the cubs scouts crossed over in February, we had a campout for them to work on tenderfoot advancements. He made it clear that it was for them, and he had a couple of leaders plan activities for them. He did not involve older boys, and went so far as to tell them they could come if they wanted, but it was for the new scouts.

Younger boys do not benefit at all from older scouts and vice versa. I've been toying with talking my youngest son into leaving this troop even though he just made Life. My older son will age out next month and wants to become an ASM. I've suggested that he call his former cubmaster who's starting a troop at a nearby church rather than stay with this one.

To make things even more cub-like, we had 16 boys cross over this year, bringing our total to about 40. Of these 16 boys, I think we got 12 new registered adults (we had five or six SM/ASMs previously). They all have a cub scout mentality, and I know a couple registered and are coming on campouts "because little Johnny has never camped away from me."

This goes beyond the two boys in a BOR discussion, but your responses have me convinced that I should contact the District Advancement Chair. Due to our SM's long term involvement at the district level I am not very optimistic. If nothing happens I'll try Council, because the boys in this troop are getting shortchanged.

[wagionvigil]

There are more problems than the advancement. I think the SM needs to attend Outdoor Training. ANd maybe SM Fundamentals again. The Committee needs to step in and demand he makes changes. Have someone willing to step up when he quits. I believe he thinks he cannot be replaced.

[smtroop168]

Is any one surprised? There always seems to be a "Paul Harvey-rest of the story" to most of these scouting questions posted on the forum.

[wagionvigil]

Seems like this SM and the Mother from your troop smtroop168 would make a perfect pair

[smtroop168]

Two pieces of work for sure! We can add the guy from CA and we got us a trifecta!

[wagionvigil]

[Scouting179]

I feel this was wrong. You short change each kid doing this and he won't give candid answers. The BORs could have been split over different days.

[Hubert]

WHen I went through mine I was glad to be alone with the board, no added pressure. What would happen if one passed and the other failed? Would that one who didnt pass be critixed by the other? In a Haha I did it you didnt kind of sense? I wouldnt think so (because we ARE scouts) but it does happen. So I personally think this SM needs some training, Id rather have to wait a week then to have it in a group. Just mho.

[Fibonacci]

I shared this issue (two Scouts in one Tenderfoot BoR) with my 16 year old Life Scout son at dinner last night. His view: this BoR is the first opportunity a new Scout has to see that there are some other adults personally interested in his progress as a Scout and in him in particular. Having two Scouts diminishes this opportunity to be the center of attention.

I remember glancing over at his first BoR years ago and seeing how nervous he was. It's interesting to me that he recalls it with this view to feeling special.

[DadScout]

We've only done a group BoR for the those new boys going for the Scout badge (joining rank). It's not official, since it's not required, and we let the boys know that. We just introduce the boys and committee members, explain to them what our jobs in the troop are and what future BoR will be like. We ask them what they like/don't like about Scouting ( or WEBELOS), Quickly re-inforce the YP rules etc.

Like I said, it's not official or required. It's very informal and basically call it an "Introductory Board of Review"