when is it time to ask a scout to leave the troop

[evmori]

Excellent post Lynda! You are so correct!

[deweylure]

Here is the up date since I posted the topic.

We had a discussion with the parents and boys. they know what is acceptable .
The CC who is the mom is looking around and will leave in the fall. Her son is going to camp. She will be there with him.
The other will not be going . Mom and Dad wanted to get a chaperone for him,but this to me goes against BSA policy. Other parents complained since we had our meeting about continued problems

I hate loosing 2 boys but I am exhausted so are the other leaders.

Thanks for the help on this one .

dewey

[Lynda J]

It is always sad when we lose boys in our troops because of discipline problems. But we always have to look out for the safety of the largest number of boys. And we can not allow one boy to destroy the program for the others.

[ASM-142]

Mom and Dad wanted to get a chaperone for him,but this to me goes against BSA policy.

What policy is this against? For a special needs kid a chaperone (or in school a dedicated aide) is a good thing.

[Mrw]

Hiring a chaperone to take an unruly kid to summer camp rather rubs me the wrong way too.

Although we didn't tell him to leave, our biggest discipline issue did not re-charter this spring. I am guessing I am not the only troop adult who was releived.

[Billiken]

Mom and Dad wanted to get a chaperone for him,but this to me goes against BSA policy.

What policy is this against? For a special needs kid a chaperone (or in school a dedicated aide) is a good thing.

Page 6 -- G2SS:

"All aspects of the Scouting program are open to observation by parents and leaders."

Parents...NOT chaperone, au pair, nanny, parents' friend, parents' agent, etc.

As I read it, PARENT means the person or persons having legal (parental) authority over the minor child in question.

[MisterChris]

Well, it doesn't really go 'against' BSA policy, as long as the chaperone doesn't share a tent with the kid. (No adults allowed with scouts in a tent etc. unless they are a parent)

The troop can 'mandate' that if the parents want to continue allowing Jr to attend campouts that he has a PARENT along to control and/or discipline and/or witness his 'lawless and disruptive acts'.

But it's not against BSA policy per se to have a 'chaperone' attend. As long as the chaperone is another scout's parent, or a leader or committee member in the troop. I imagine it's against BSA policy to allow an unregistered adult who is not a parent of someone in the troop to just 'show up and come along' on campouts.

But it might be against the troop's policy in this situation. A chaperone does not have power of attorney or legal right to discipline or drive the scout home alone, if the scout gets out of hand. I see that whole mess as fraught with issues.

[deweylure]

by chaperone I meant a college student who is not in the troop and is not 21. Originally Mom and Dad agreed that they would go on the camping trip. At sign up for Summer caqmp ,Dad was going then Mom . Mom is not going now because she can not control the boy.

The policy I refer to is a non registered person. I refuse to let this happen. I do not know the student .

Dewey

[FrankJ]

Some summer camps require all adults that spend the night with the troop to be registered with BSA. I know the aurgument that they cannot do this, but it is a reasonable thing to me and I have never pushed it.I have registered parent helpers as commitee members to meet this requirement. A none related chaperone in this case would have to be registered & take youth protection. Neither a big issue.

A scout with disruptive behavior issues that require a full time chaperone would be a real headache at summer camp. I would be in full support of the troop management making a considered decision not to allow this. The troop is allowed to set standard of conduct.

[ASM-142]

Hiring a chaperone to take an unruly kid to summer camp rather rubs me the wrong way too.

Although we didn't tell him to leave, our biggest discipline issue did not re-charter this spring. I am guessing I am not the only troop adult who was releived.

There is a difference between an unrully kid and a disabled kid.

Also, being that this kids mother is the CC and do not know how you can keep him off the charter

[Mrw]

Out of control does not necessarily mean disabled!

And frankly, if the mother will not go to camp with him because she has no control, there is no reason in the world to think a hired college kid would be any more effective.

[616kayak]

In my troop there was one kid who always wanted to do his own thing. At our car wash he would play basket ball when his station was working. Knowing he wanted to be the one playing and the one to get the ball first we made a deal. IF he worked at his station I would keep that ball for him. When he had some break time the ball would go directly to him, no other scout. This worked out great.

You should take two things from the story. One, negative behaviors can be turned into something positive (not working on time into motivation to work).

Two, a scout troop is a diverse organization. Each scout has different motivations and different skills. This scout is motivated by something. The key is to find this motivation and use it. Easier said than done.

[deweylure]

Mom who is the CC has announced he will be leaving the troop after summer camp. The other boy however can not go to summer camp at all. the CC son is by far the bigger problem.

I found the decision to allow one and not the other annoys me. Mom in this case the CC should have had no input on the matter since her son is one of the problems.













c

[FrankJ]

I would say the adult leaders actually at summer camp should have a large say in the matter. Also they make it clear that scouts not following the scout law can be sent home. Whoever is listed as the camp leader for the troop should have the final say.

[wagionvigil]

The leaders taking the troop have the final say the CC does not. If I was one of the leaders I would simply say If they go I am nopt You take them.
I would not be joking. Aolso I would consider these boys a safety problem for the remainder of the troop.

[deweylure]

The leader who will be in charge this year took the stance of I will not go if these boys attend.
The final verdict is one boy is going,one boy is not. If the one going messes around and becomes disruptive his mom the CC will be there.
They can both leave togeather.

I hope camp goes well. I will have to wait and see.

[cballman]

as i tell the troop and parents of kids that are going to summer camp with me if I have a bad problem with a child I will make 1 phone call to come and get this child. if they refuse or are to busy to worry about their child my next call is to the local police and have them come to camp and get this child. PERIOD I will have other kids that really want to be there to worry about. just another quote from a famoue movie again.

the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the one

now I havent had a big problem at camp in the past few years since I took that stance.

[cballman]

Just another thought why would anyone that is leaving a troop and at a certain date because of problems with the troop want to take their kid to camp with that troop? seems like a stupid move on the parents and the klids part. just another thought.

[maricopasem]

Just another thought why would anyone that is leaving a troop and at a certain date because of problems with the troop want to take their kid to camp with that troop?

Perhaps because it would be too late to get him involved with another troop going to camp, thereby causing him to lose out on the experience, the badges, etc.

[deweylure]

Yes it is to late. Camp money is turned in. Also the troop he wants to transfer too attends the same camp. We actually share a campsite and this scout is well known to them.

dewey