Uniform/Travel Question

[ThunderingWind]

We have a council trip to Sea Base this summer. We are two "crews" per Sea Base naming. We are doing the Keys Adventure.

Most of Crew A are members of a local Crew (mine).

We have a new "youth" crew member looking at coming on the trip. He is now 18 and listed on the Troop rooster as an Assistant Scoutmaster
but he is also educationally challenged and it took him a little over his 18th birth day to complete one item required to make Eagle. But he did
make Eagle.

The question of which uniform to wear while traveling under the Tour Permit came up. Should this new "youth" spend the money to buy the official Venture Program uniform or can he still wear the Boy Scout tan.

If he goes on the trip, the Crew he is joning does have a clause in the by-laws that state the official Venture Program uniform will be used if required.
Since the economy is an issue in our area, should we still "highly recommend" the Green and Grey rather than the Tan and Sage?

Just looking at how this might be interpreted as his Troop Tan now has the ASM patch on it.

If y'all can quote any official policies, that would be great. I really do not see any absolutes in the Sea Base regs other than wear an official uniform while traveling. His is an official uniform.

[FrankJ]

In terms of the Official BSA rules, he can travel in uniform or out of uniform. BSA recommends that crews travel in uniform for a lot of good reasons. If he "officially" joins the crew, then he should follow their rules. If he is provisionally part of the crew just for the trip, I would let him travel in the tan uniform.

[divermann]

I concure with FrankJ; unless your Council has made it a requirement or if it's a trip to an International Event, uniform wear is not a requirement. This is copied from the Travel to Philmont page at Scouting.org:

Travel Etiquette
Scouts and Venturers are respected nationwide because of how they travel and appear to the public. To maintain a positive appearance and good public image, follow this advice:

Wear your Scout or Venturing uniform proudly! You are members of the Boy Scouts of America, a highly regarded youth organization. A Scout or Venturer properly uniformed, sharp appearing, courteous, and well mannered is the best medium for public relations.
Use the buddy system; no one person ever leaves the group alone.
Telephone ahead to your next day's stopping place. It is inconsiderate to drop in or cancel without adequate notification.
Do not use tobacco in public. It may be offensive to those around you.
Express appreciation to those who extend courtesies to you along the way.

I believe this is a crew issue and considering the special circumstanses, your Crew will make the correct decision.

[ThunderingWind]

In terms of the Official BSA rules, he can travel in uniform or out of uniform.

Per Sea Base Participant Guide: "Sea Base requires that your crew carry on the Scouting tradition by arriving at Sea Base in uniform." The bold is mine.

So we take this as we must travel in uniform as there is no time to stop, dig out the uniform and put it on in a properly BSA certified changing faciltiy.

It was announced by the Council that any dual membership youth (Troop and Crew) do not have to purchase the Green and Grey for the purposes of this trip. but it was never discussed as to how to handle Crew Youth/Troop Adult in this case.

I wish the Uniform Regulations were an absolute and there was no room for ambiguity. I would much prefer the regs to state, the uniform is a required part of the program and if your are youth member of the program your wear this, if you are an dults you wear this, if you are dual enrolled, you need a unform for each program. They should also include something like: If your Crew attends a national event, or High Adventure base (Philmont, Sea Base, list all of them), an official BSA Venture Program uniform is required. If Venture Program Youth attend as part of a Council group and their primary registration is the Venture Program, an official BSA Venture Program uniform is required.

[divermann]

Ahhh ThunderingWind, I seeeeee, the ole' "Camp Tradition Uniform Rule". I now see your dilemma. Maybe take them at their word and use "Venturing units should consider as a Field uniform their unit shirt and Scout shorts"? That gives you some flexibility, unit shirt is the crew's choice and Scout shorts could be green or grey. I totally agree with your last statement regarding unity. I find it interesting that you could arrive at Philmont not in "Official Uniform" and Sea Base requires "Official Uniform". Anyone know what the arrival requirement is at Northern Tier?

[ThunderingWind]

Ahhh ThunderingWind, I seeeeee, the ole' "Camp Tradition Uniform Rule". I now see your dilemma. Maybe take them at their word and use "Venturing units should consider as a Field uniform their unit shirt and Scout shorts"? That gives you some flexibility, unit shirt is the crew's choice and Scout shorts could be green or grey. I totally agree with your last statement regarding unity. I find it interesting that you could arrive at Philmont not in "Official Uniform" and Sea Base requires "Official Uniform". Anyone know what the arrival requirement is at Northern Tier?

That is part of the problem. the Crew by-laws state crew t-shirt and shorts/pants but the official BSA Greena dn Grey if required. So as a Crew Advisor, I see this a "Required."

But since this is a Council trip, I am taking a step back because hlf of the youth are Boy Scouts. I am trying to gather "policy" before I take it to the council as we have time to order a shirt and shorts should it become absolutley required.

One issue is that Sea Base even calls Troops that come Crews because of their nautical theme. And out Council trip is a mixed bag so to speak of youths.

[wagionvigil]

Tan and green is fine

[smtroop168]

Since you are going to Sea Base, I know a place that issues Navy uniforms. You just have to sign a couple of pieces of paper and they will give them to you.

[FrankJ]

This is what the current participant guide says about uniforms.

"The official BSA uniform is highly recommended while traveling to and from Sea Base, and is required
during flag raising, and breakfast and evening meals at Base." is what it says in one place. Another implies that is required for travel. So Sea base is fairly conflicted on what is actually required.

So if you want to eat at the base, you want a uniform. Venturing crews that do not use the official uniform are free to substitute their own.

Why not present this to your crew as an ethical dilemma? Do you make some go buy a different uniform for crew just for uniformity of dress?

Being that Sea Base is in the Fla Keys, I doubt the uniform police will have a full force there. If I was taking a Venturing crew, I would agitate for a crew uniform of Hawaiian shirts.

[VenturingL]

When our crew went, we wore green BSA to Brighton Center (all were Venturers). We wore our home-grown Crew t-shirts for flag 2x day - base just wanted each crew dressed alike within it. There was a troop who had identical Hawaiian shirts with Troop # embroidered on them. Most of the time you are going to be in swimsuit & a t-shirt you don't care about because it is going to be drowned in salt water every day. We were instructed to NOT wear anything BSA related the day we went to Key West. We went in 2006 - anybody who has gone more recently know of any dramatic changes? We wore the dress green home on the plane.

[ThunderingWind]

Since you are going to Sea Base, I know a place that issues Navy uniforms. You just have to sign a couple of pieces of paper and they will give them to you.

I was hoping to get drafted into the Conch Navy!!!!!