What is a disability as far as MBs are concerned

[Jean9]

Hi all,
I would like opinions about what should be considered a disability when dealing with MB requirements. I am not talking about major disabilities like paralysis, severe autism, Down's Syndrome/severe developmental delays, but thing like ADHD, Learning Disabilities, and processing problems. I have a problem with the idea that a boy who could do all the requirements getting special treatment because he has an IEP for a minor disability.
I am not trying to pick on anyone, I just have real concerns about boys being able to take an easy way out when there is no need for them to do that. I have 2 sons who would qualify as disabled but we refuse to let them use that to get out of doing the requirements. If they don't do the requirement, they don't advance until they do. Will this make it harder for them to advance? Yes it will, but they will be better for it in the long run.
Am I wrong for thinking that all boys, even the ones with disabilities, should be pushed to go beyond what they think they can do?
I appreciate any opinions you all have.
Jeannine

[Mrw]

In my opinion, disability adjustments are for the kids who cannot and will never be able to complete the requirements. And for most merit badges, this really only should apply to the required badges, as there should be enough other choices for the non-required that they can find something they CAN do.

Most learning disabilities mean the child learns differently or at a different speed than other kids. Not that they cannot learn. In this respect, the merit badge program where they can do it at their own speed, and often learn by doing rather than reading, should be easier than school.

[cballman]

Most kids these days will fall into that catagory because their parents want to make excuses for the kids. An example I had a mother who asked how to get the requirements changed because her son had problems. She went into detail about how her kids couldnt do this or that. It then rested on her shoulders because her kids had never tried because she didnt want them to fail. Man how can we not learn from failing. Its like frying an egg. Youi have to try and fail before you can cook one right. Same thing with life. I dont want any kid to fail but sometimes they need to to learn.

[FrankJ]

There are no exceptions for merit badges. The requirements must be met as stated. If the the disability is permanent & insurmountable then they need to go the alternate merit badge route. We have our share of scouts in our troop with issues that require IEPs, (my son is one), and I am all for accommodations that allow them to succeed, but to lower expectations is doing a disservice to them.

[smtroop168]

There is an entire BSA publication on this subject.

For T/2/1 alternative requirements there is a 4 step process
1. Do as many standard requirements as possible
2. Secure a medical statement - from a licenced health care provider - NOT a Vet as my Brother in Law got in CT. Generally the scout needs to have a permanent physical or mental disability.
3. Prepare a request for alternative requirements - you suggest which ones
4. The Council Advancement Commitee reviews the request


For MBs - it really only applies for Eagle Required Badges. As previously stated there are many others available for a scout to get the non-required ones. All MBs requirements must be completed to earn the badge must be completed as written. You can't do part of a MB and ask to waive one of them. The alternative MB Process is similar. BSA Form 58-730 is used. The form does not list alternatives for any of the Citizenship MBs, Personal Management, Family Life or First Aid.

[wagionvigil]

FYI this is another subject trying to Justify them allowing alternatives


There are scouts that truly need the alternative MB Requirements then there are those that are looking for Easy.

[alex gregory]

I would add that a Scout with high-functioning autism or an autism spectrum disorder (ASD) like Asperger's should be able to satisify all rank or MB requirements. In some cases you may need to provide more direction and it may take a little longer. The two Scouts I have helped work on Citizenship MBs with ASD were much better at working with me one-on-one with a parent present rather than in a group, but they were fine working on the physically active MBs in a group of other scouts at summer camp.

[Quailman]

My son, age 16, is going to try the swimming MB at summer camp. He has CP and as a result his legs are pretty weak. He'll have trouble showing good strong form when swimming the 150 yards. He should be able to get his pants off to use as a flotation device. And the biggest issue with getting an object off the bottom is that he always bobs like a cork (not a side effect of CP), so he may have trouble getting to the bottom. Actually it's his leg weakness that makes it difficult to kick his way down too deep. I told him that if he can't get it from the bottom of the deep end to ask them to put it "In water over your head" as requirement 7 states.

He wants to try Swimming, and if he can't do it, he wants to try Cycling, and if 50 miles in 8 hours is too far he'll ask for an alternate MB.

As for the original poster's question, any boy with a disability should be given the opportunity to try any MB he wants, but as has been stated there are no substitutes or passes for requirements in earning MBs. He either completes them all or he doesn't get the badge. If it's Eagle required he can ask for an alternate.

[wagionvigil]

Lots of the reclining bikes in this part of Pa. They would probably work well for your son.

[Cowboy]

Fulfill all requirements. If a boy has a disability that would prevent him from completing something, BSA has set up strict and formal guidelines for that. There is no such thing as Troop disability. If a boy can not read, go through National procedures. If a boy has ADHD, too bad! Scouts is one of the best therapies that I have ever seen for that "disability". Sound cold and heartless? No problem: Son #1 has been diagnosed with sever ADHD, my biggest mistake in his upbringing was allowing him to drop out of Scouts as 1st Class. I was diagnosed with the same thing 30 years ago and have found that as an adult with ADHD being a Scouter is one of the stabilizing factors in my life. Leave the disabilities at the door with all of the other excuses.

[Mrw]

.

He wants to try Swimming, and if he can't do it, he wants to try Cycling, and if 50 miles in 8 hours is too far he'll ask for an alternate MB.

He might be much more comfortable on a recumbent trike (such as a Greenspeed) for the distance and because he may not balance as well if his legs get tired. Or maybe you can find a tandem partner for him. On a tandem, the captain has to control the bike and start/stop/balance etc while the stoker only needs to pedal.

[Quailman]

He has a three-speed adult tricycle. The biggest concern is covering 50 miles in 8 hours with his leg strength and stamina issues. In this part of Texas hills are not a factor.

[Mrw]

Just make sure he does the into the Texas wind part of the ride first, so the tailwind will push him home!

[Jean9]

Thank you all for your replies. As I stated, we will not let either of our boys claim a disability to get out of fulfilling any requirements. I agree that boys can use a minor disability as a way to get out of being challenged and should be forced to do all they can do and then and only then should they be allowed certain modifications.
Jeannine

[Mixedbatch37]

The following are quotes from "Advancement Committee Policies and Procedures" and from "Scouting for Youth with Disabilities," both BSA Official directives, which tell us so much about how to deal with disability as applied to MBs AND Advancement. One is, "The standard for every boy is, 'Did he do his best?'" At the end of the ACPP section dealing with Scouts with Special needs, it closes with the sentence, "It is urged that common sense always be employed." In that section it says:"To keep Scouts with disabilities as much in the advancement mainstream as possible (implying that BSA wants to mainstream as much as possible), some advancement accommodations may be required." This doesn't mention "alternate." This refers to accommodations to "standard requirements." How do I know that? Because the next two sentences explain; "Thus, a Scout in a wheelchair can meet the requirements for hiking by making a trip to a place of interest in his community. Giving more time and permitting the use of special aids are other ways leaders can help Scouts with disabilities in their efforts to advance." Another quote: "It has been traditional to make some accommodations in advancement requirements if absolutely necessary. This policy is designed to help Scouts with disabilities succeed along with their peers. Practical suggestions are made to leaders as to adaptive approaches and methods they can use." "In the application of these policies for Scouts with special needs, reasonable accommodation in the performance of requirements for advancement may be made. These may include such things as extension of time, adaptation of facilities, or the use of equipment or necessary devices consistent with the known physical or mental limitations of the handicapped individual." Then, it closes the section on special needs with a crowning directive. "It is urged that common sense be employed." Note the use of "urged."

These sentiments are reiterated in the "Alternate Merit Badges for the Eagle Scout Rank" block on p. 43 of the Guide. "Merit badges are awarded only when the requirements are met as stated." But, remember that is "as stated in the current official literature of the Boy Scouts of America." (Too many people wil read this as "Merit Badge Booklet.) It repeats, "The candidate must earn as many of the required merit badges as his ability permits before applying for an alternate Eagle Scout rank Merit Badge." And finally, "…a candidate is expected to do his best in developing himself to the limit of his resources."