merit badges requested by one or two scouts

[AdvancementMom]

I am the Advancement Chair of our troop. The Scoutmaster has a practice of not allowing any scout to take a badge unless it is offered to the troop. He does not acknowledge the initiative boys take to locate a counselor on their own and instead wants every badge to be offered to the entire troop if anyone takes it. How do I handle this?

[Mrw]

Try having the district advancement chair talk to him about why none of the boys from your troop ever take advantage of the resources available to take merit badges with the counselors on the district list. As the district person to approach it as if they are wondering why your troop is different from all the other troops in the area.

I get the impression that you have already talked to the SM about this yourself and have gotten nowhere. Unless your troop has registered counselors for nearly ALL the badges available, your boys are really getting short-changed.

Has your SM gone through the SM training to make sure he understands how the program is supposed to work?

[AdvancementMom]

He was trained many years ago. It's always been his policy to offer it to the troop or you can't take it. I'll try the district advancement chair approach. I've addressed it with him, and will also try to plead my case (again) at the next Troop Committee meeting. Thanks for the suggestions.

[OldGreyBear]

Some people can be such knuckleheads over some things and wonderful at others. have a scout work on and complete and merit badge that is not offred to the troop. As a Committee Member you can be the Troop Leader who signs the blue card. When the blue card comes back, properly signed by an approved merit badge counselor award him the badge. It's not the scoutmaster's job to decide which and when the scout will do merit badges, it can only discourage scouts. Of course, you could cause a huge issue in the troop and need to decide to big an issue this is

[RWSmith]

AdvancementMom, First off, welcome to the board.

Second, here are just a few threads (which I pulled up from inputing blue AND cards into the board's Search feature) that you might find interesting:

• MB Approval and Signatures
  
• MB How many open merit badges
  
• MB Evidence for Pets
  
• Merit Badge Counseling

All, The Search feature is a great tool for new folks to drill down and retreive information. Note: You can use AND to define words which must be in the results, OR to define words which may be in the result and NOT to define words which should not be in the result. Use * as a wildcard for partial matches.

[jr56]

There are several publications that define the merit badge program and how it is supposed to work. Several that come to mind are the Boy Scout handbook, requirement book, merit badge counselor pamphlet, advancement policy and procedure guide, just to name a few. Anybody that can ignore all these resources is a pretty sad case. The committee chair needs to be made aware, as well as the district advancement chair.
A unit commissioner might be another good resource.

[outfoxed86]

I am the Advancement Chair of our troop. The Scoutmaster has a practice of not allowing any scout to take a badge unless it is offered to the troop. He does not acknowledge the initiative boys take to locate a counselor on their own and instead wants every badge to be offered to the entire troop if anyone takes it. How do I handle this?

What does your Committee Chairman have to say about this practice. He/She should be stepping in and telling the SM that his pratice isnt proper. The Merit badge system is desigined to help the scouts learn how to contact someone they dont know,set up an appointment with them ,and follow thru with the meeting of the counsler. This is all part of the aims of the boy scouts, build moral strength and character, foster citizenship,and develop fitness.
Wayne

[Lynda J]

So many times I have seem SM's that think because they were Scouts or because they took training 20+ years ago they know everything about scouting. I wish SM's would retake training about every 5 years.
I have worked in Scouting for close to 40 years. And guess what I still don't know everything. I have retaken several trainings simply because I like hearing what others are doing. A SM that is so narrow minded and unflexable really doesn't need to be a SM. Talk to your District Advancement Chair and if that doesn't work talk to your District Execitive.
We actually like it when our boys go out of troop to find a counselor.

[WeeWillie]

There was a time when Scouts were expected to use MBCs from the District MBC Roster. None of my MBs were earned from a troop MBC.

One of the current major problems with advancement is troops are running merit badge mills with rather weak interpretations of the requirements.

[lifescoutforlife]

My son went through something like what you are talking about, everyone or no one, this about put him out of scouts, he really enjoys doing MB's and is now in another troop were each kid is on there own path which is the way it should be.

[vpalango]

In our troop we've successfully done both. The troop has parents who are counselors for a variety of badges. But as a Scoutmaster (and my predicessor as well), I actively encourage the boys to get some merit badges from a counselor on the District list, so that they experience doing some of the MBs on thier own. The only requirement (which is mandated effectively by YPT/GSS) I put on them is that they have to buddy up for the badge with another scout/scouts.

Generally, boys in my troop earn 3-6 MBs from counselors outside the troop, the rest are earned either at Summer Camp, through the District MBU program, or via "in-house" MB Counselors. (again, this is an average, off the top of my head sort of thing, there are clearly execptions to the rule)

Just as another note, with the "in-house" counselors, many of the boys are doing the badges in the "traditional" manner, outside other troop activities. In no way are we offering all the badges in a "classroom" format with the whole troop, instead we have some dedicated parents who are willing to counsel scouts within the troop on a small-group basis outside troop meetings.

YIS,

[outfoxed86]

In our troop we've successfully done both. The troop has parents who are counselors for a variety of badges. But as a Scoutmaster (and my predicessor as well), I actively encourage the boys to get some merit badges from a counselor on the District list, so that they experience doing some of the MBs on thier own. The only requirement (which is mandated effectively by YPT/GSS) I put on them is that they have to buddy up for the badge with another scout/scouts.
YIS,

vpalango
I have a question. You say here that as Scoutmaster you encourage your scouts to get some outside merit badge councselors. Dont you or your advancement chairman give these to them? The Scoutmaster signs the "Bluecard" before the boy does the merit badge to approve that the boy is alloud to do it with the chosen counselor.

[Mrw]

The only requirement (which is mandated effectively by YPT/GSS) I put on them is that they have to buddy up for the badge with another scout/scouts.

I certainly make sure our boys know they are to take a buddy to see the counselor, but a parent will do just as well as another scout. This works well when the boy wants a badge that none of his buddies are interested in.

[FrankJ]

My interpretation of the "Scoutmaster sign the blue card" is that certifies the scout is ready to take the merit badge, NOT approving a particular counselor. If the scout comes back with the card signed off by a counselor on the council's list of approved counselors, there is not a lot the SM can say about it.

The SM is obligated to provide names of counselors. The scout is not obligated to use one that the SM assigns.

A SM not signing a blue card should be a rare event based on the SM decision that the individual scout is not ready for a specific merit badge, not general age or rank specific rules.

[outfoxed86]

My interpretation of the "Scoutmaster sign the blue card" is that certifies the scout is ready to take the merit badge, NOT approving a particular counselor. If the scout comes back with the card signed off by a counselor on the council's list of approved counselors, there is not a lot the SM can say about it.

The SM is obligated to provide names of counselors. The scout is not obligated to use one that the SM assigns.

A SM not signing a blue card should be a rare event based on the SM decision that the individual scout is not ready for a specific merit badge, not general age or rank specific rules.

FrankJ
I understand what your saying. How does a boy find the approved merit badge counselors? Do you supply evey boy with the list and just let them pick who they want? I'm just couriuos how you do the process. How can a boy start the merit badge with out the sig of the scoutmaster or advancement chair?

The blue card has two places for the Scoutmaster to sign the First is to let the boy start the merit badge(from the Bluecard "is qualified to begin working for merit badge noted on the reverse side") and the other is at the completetion of the badge.(from the bluecard"has given me his completed application for the merit badge")

Lets say I hear that a meritbadge counselor just meets with a scout for five min and signs a badge off and never reall y checks his work.Its known around but for political reasons he's still there.(we all know this does happen in all councils, the political stuff) I wouldnt want my scouts going to him. Your telling me I have no choice. Thats why we assign merit badge counselors. also part of the merit badge process is to have scouts call people they dont know and set up the appiontment.(I'm sure you will all argue with me that this isnt a rule) I would think if a scout picked his own counselor he would look for someone he knows

[PaulSWolf]

From Boy Scout Reuirements 2007 (33215)

Pick A Subject. Talk to your Scoutmaster about your interests. Read the requirements of the merit badges you think might interest you. Pick one to earn. Your Scoutmaster will give you the name of a person from a list of counselors. These counselors have special knowledge in their merit badge subjects and are interested in helping you.

Note that it specifically says "Your Scoutmaster will give you the name of a person from a list of counselors".

[ASM-142]

What is the criteria for

(from the Bluecard "is qualified to begin working for merit badge noted on the reverse side")

?

Is this just being a registered scout or does the SM have the right to not sign based on some other criteria?

[ASM-142]

From Boy Scout Reuirements 2007 (33215)

Pick A Subject. Talk to your Scoutmaster about your interests. Read the requirements of the merit badges you think might interest you. Pick one to earn. Your Scoutmaster will give you the name of a person from a list of counselors. These counselors have special knowledge in their merit badge subjects and are interested in helping you.

Note that it specifically says "Your Scoutmaster will give you the name of a person from a list of counselors".

Is the scout required to use the counselor this counselor or can he use another approved counselor?

[Mrw]

Our Council is working towards having the names of the MBC's available on the web site with their approval. One of our kids has found it and is using this. The only real issue is that I would send him to someone closer to home for the things he has taken. I also know the person and know they work well with the boys and don't sign if it is not deserved.

Maybe it sounds like a control issue, but I like to know who they boys are going to and to be able to steer them to or away from a particular counselor if I see a reason to do so.

Our boys do need to see the SM for a blue card, but he sends them to me for counselor names. I also keep a handful of blank cards if they are needed and he is not around on a given day.

[jhawk]

I don't interpret the passage that the scoutmaster "will give the name of a counselor" to mean that the scout must use that counselor. I think the intention of that passage was just to show one way in which a scout may find a counselor. Most scouts that I know do not have the councilwide list of merit badge counselors. I don't think that just because someone says Mr. Jones counsels for that badge means the scout is obligated to use that person. It will ease the way for scouts who don't know where to find a counselor for a particular badge, but I don't believe it is a requirement.
Actually, unless the scoutmaster has an updated list of counselors in front of him everytime he recommends someone, he might inadvertantly send a scout to someone not currently registered with the council. Only the council office knows for sure! to paraphrase an old commercial.... I think if you know someone registered, you can use them. If not, ask the council who is approved to do that badge. The council is the one to approve of a counselor for any badge. If the council approves them, they have BSA permission to counsel any scout anytime anywhere as long as they follow the buddy system for any face-to-face contact, whether that is another scout taking the badge or not, or a parent, sibling, friend, etc.
I was sure never taught in merit badge counselor training that I could only counsel a scout specifically sent to me by a scoutmaster.
In fact, it doesn't even say on the bluecard that the signature has to be the SM, just a unit leader. In our troop we DO have the SM sign both times, but I think other troops allow this to be other people in the unit. I don't have a problem with either one, but I would have a problem with any adult telling any scout exactly which counselor they MUST use.... I really appreciate 99.99% of what I have ever read Paul write about anything here, but I'd have to disagree with your interpretation on this one, Paul.