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An interesting situation has arisen in my sphere of influence, and I'd like to "hear" the thoughts of the collective wisdom here...

Scouts A and B are dual-registered in two troops, one LDS troop (Troop X) and one non-LDS troop (Troop Y). Troop X is small in number, has a long history of OA activity, but dropped off the scope for several years. Troop Y is very large (120+ members), has a long history of OA activity, but has seen the number of boys selected for OA drop dramatically over the past three years. Leadership is attributing this to large influxes of new members (25-30 per year) over the past three years, with the thought that many of the new boys aren't connecting names on ballots with faces of eligible electees. Typical selection groups prior to the massive influx numbered 8-12 boys. Last two selection groups numbered 2-4 boys.

Scouts A and B are both OA-eligible. Neither was selected in this year's election in Troop Y. Leadership, without disclosing results, have implied that Scout A fared well in the election while not receiving the minimum votes required due to the large voting group, but deserved selection. Nothing noted for Scout B.

Troop X has just announced they will be holding OA elections next week. Only Scouts eligible from Troop X are Scouts A and B. SM for Troop X is also an ASM for Troop Y.

Scout A met with CC and SM from Troop Y to discuss OA election in Troop X. Scout A would prefer to be selected from Troop X. Troop Y CC shared story with Scout A about past Eagle Scouts from Troop Y who never were selected from Troop Y, and if Scout A is truly interested in participation in OA, he should not let the potential opportunity pass while hoping for selection from Troop Y. Only concern is possibility of Troop Y OA-Scouts holding activities that would not include Scout A if he is elected from Troop X because of where his selection came from.

Thoughts?

Nothing I have seen in the OA election rules really covers this. My opinion, The scout is registered in a troop. Meets the criteria for election & is elected, He is in. What happens in the other troop does not matter. I would not worry about it too much. It is all part of a game.

As for as the activities issue. We are all brothers in the OA, if you are excluding brothers because how/where they were elected, you are just Wrong & are missing the point of the OA & scouting in general.

One bit advice for the larger troop: hold the election before cross overs start. That avoids the issue of the new scout having a vote, but not knowing the candidates.

Elections are held before the crossovers. Problem is with such large crossovers, 60-70 percent of those present during the elections are first- and second-year guys who might know the faces but not the names of the eligible candidates. Leadership is looking at putting pictures on the ballot next year to help address this problem.

ronin718 wrote:... Only concern is possibility of Troop Y OA-Scouts holding activities that would not include Scout A if he is elected from Troop X because of where his selection came from. ...

OA-Scouts in Troop Y are holding troop-level OA activities? Never heard of such a thing. Even if they are holding such activities, Scout A is an OA member and a member of Troop Y, so should be invited to such activities. If he's not, then someone should have a talk with the boys who planned the activity and put an end to such unscoutlike behavior.

For clarification... Troop Y has a large number of OA members. In the interests of increasing service to the community, the Troop OA members are planning activities of service specifically for the troop OA members to participate in, separate from the larger OA body.

Sorry ronin718...reading the scenario made me dizzy. IMHO..Troop x and Troop Y are separate entitites and hold their own elections and the chips fall where they lay. The fact they scouts are dual registered is allowed by the BSA so therefore should be allowed by the OA.

For new crossovers, I would let them recuse themselves and make note of it on the election form results.

smtroop168 wrote:Sorry ronin718...reading the scenario made me dizzy.

I understand. Living the scenario is doing more than making me dizzy.

smtroop168 wrote:For new crossovers, I would let them recuse themselves and make note of it on the election form results.

Following the rules, you can ask that they recluse themselves, but you cannot require them to. You do not need to note it on the results because all scouts have an option not to vote. The elected are the majority of the cast, not of those present.

I'm just curious...

After registration with a troop or team, have experienced 15 days and nights of Boy Scout camping during the two-year period prior to the election. The 15 days and nights must include one, but no more than one, long-term camp consisting of six consecutive days and five nights of resident camping, approved and under the auspices and standards of the Boy Scouts of America. The balance of the camping must be overnight, weekend, or other short-term camps.

"Boy Scout Camping" doesn't have to be with the troop he's elected from, does it? It's not specified, and I'm certain that a boy who moved and transferred his registration could count nights with first troop in addition to his new one. I'm guessing that nights camping with either troop count.

It means an overnight camping experience that falls under the umbrella of Boy Scouts. You could nights camping out with a provisional week at summer camp or even a National Jamboree contingent. It's only meant to differentiate from camping in the backyard on your own, or camping with mom and dad or friends.

FrankJ wrote:

smtroop168 wrote:For new crossovers, I would let them recuse themselves and make note of it on the election form results.

Following the rules, you can ask that they recluse themselves, but you cannot require them to. You do not need to note it on the results because all scouts have an option not to vote. The elected are the majority of the cast, not of those present.

FrankJ....I don't want them the hide (recluse) just decide on their own not to vote.

smtroop168 wrote:FrankJ....I don't want them the hide (recluse) just decide on their own not to vote.

Would have expected nothing less from you.

It's a quirk of mine.

I had to gently tell a 3 star Admiral that it was Principle not Principal on one of his briefing slides he was preparing to give the Chief of Naval Operations.

Just to clarify for a non OA Scouter: There is an actual "rule" regarding the elections? I was of the understanding that OA elections required that if a boy received one vote he was in. For some reason our OA elections always seem to fall when I am busy with something, so have never paid much attention to them.

Cowboy wrote:Just to clarify for a non OA Scouter: There is an actual "rule" regarding the elections? I was of the understanding that OA elections required that if a boy received one vote he was in. For some reason our OA elections always seem to fall when I am busy with something, so have never paid much attention to them.

Absolutely. Wagion is the OA expert but you can refer to

http://www.oa-bsa.org/misc/basics/index.html

to learn more

Cowboy wrote:Just to clarify for a non OA Scouter: There is an actual "rule" regarding the elections? I was of the understanding that OA elections required that if a boy received one vote he was in. For some reason our OA elections always seem to fall when I am busy with something, so have never paid much attention to them.

Here are the relevant rules:

At least half of the registered active youth in a unit must be present before a unit election can be held.
To be elected a youth candidate must receive half or more votes of the number of ballots turned in to the election team.

At least half of the active youth members of the Troop or team must be present, but if the younger Scouts don't know the eligible Scouts, they should refrain from turning in a ballot. Only the ballots turned in are counted toward determining how many votes are required.

Example: 29 or 30 active youth members of the Troop. At least 15 must be present.

If all 29 or 30 are present and all of them turn in ballots, even if some of the ballots are blank, the Scouts would need 15 or more votes to be elected.

If there are at least 15 present and 15 turn in ballots, even if some of the ballots are blank, the Scouts would need 8 or more votes to be elected.

If there are at least 15 present, and only 7 or 8 ballots are turned in, all Scouts with 4 or more votes would be elected.

So Cowboy is right, you can get elected with only one vote.

smtroop168 wrote:So Cowboy is right, you can get elected with only one vote.

Yes.

IF, and only if, only 1 or 2 Scouts turn in ballots.

But Paul...What if the Troop has 837 members and 590 show up and only one turns in a ballot? Does Wagion get elected?


Hey...it's Saturday night and I'm sitting here dealing with my favorite family who thinks I'm out to get their son because he wasn't put on the OA ballot. Doesn't matter that he wasn't eligible. And I'm not fostering positive feelings for the scouting program.

You should serve as A Lodge Adv. for Three Years. Espesically when no one was use to having the rules enforced.

See Troop Rules