Merit Badge procedures

[FrankJ]

Supposedly, the Scout is suppose to talk to their Scoutmaster 1st and get permission to take the class there. The way it probably works is that Mom or Dad sees the advertisement and takes their son down for the class. Since Bass Pro knows it would be bad business to turn the Scout away, they have the blue cards ready.

But this is done with nationals approval as well. I really do not have a problem with this. It is smart business for BSA as well. The challenge of the merit badge should be meeting the requirements. One of the worst things you can do is get a scout excited about something and then throw a bunch of paper work in the way. My point is you should make policy fit with reality or leave enough wiggle room in the policy to accommodate reality. The other option is to accept the policy is going to be routinely ignored when it doesn't fit the situation.

[FrankJ]

Does the new policy manual address this kind of situation? The Hypothetical scout master does not like Bass Pro for some reason. Scout comes to him for the fishing merit badge blue card. Can the SM tell the scout he cannot go to the Bass Pro shop merit badge clinic?

Hypothetical troop is responsible for 15.6% of FOS contributions so replacing the SM is not going to happen.

[smtroop168]

At least Bass recognizes that they need BSA certified MB counselors.

[smtroop168]

Does the new policy manual address this kind of situation? The Hypothetical scout master does not like Bass Pro for some reason. Scout comes to him for the fishing merit badge blue card. Can the SM tell the scout he cannot go to the Bass Pro shop merit badge clinic?

Hypothetical troop is responsible for 15.6% of FOS contributions so replacing the SM is not going to happen.

Yes the new book does address this and no the SM cannot deny the scout.

"Though it is the responsibility of a Scoutmaster for example, to see that a counselor is found and made available, the Scout may have one in mind with whom he would like to work. This is acceptable, but the unit leader should still consider the recommendation and approve it if it is appropriate."

[razor_strop]

One of the worst things you can do is get a scout excited about something and then throw a bunch of paper work in the way. My point is you should make policy fit with reality or leave enough wiggle room in the policy to accommodate reality.

Great point, Frank! In our troop, we strongly encourage Scouts to plan ahead on MBs and get a BC with the SM's or ASM's signature (which btw isn't "permission", but merely the unit leader certifying that the Scout is registered and therefore qualified to work on the MB). However, if "things happen" then we allow the Scout to call/email the SM or an ASM and get an immediate verbal authorization, to be followed at the next opportunity with an actual signature on the BC. Of course, the MBC could always decide to not work with the Scout without the signed BC, but we can only control our own policies.

[smtroop168]

In our troop, we strongly encourage Scouts to plan ahead on MBs and get a BC with the SM's or ASM's signature (which btw isn't "permission", but merely the unit leader certifying that the Scout is registered and therefore qualified to work on the MB).

Wrong: I say again: Approval = Permission

Any Scout may work on any MB at any time; up until he turns 18 – if he has the approval of his unit leader. This is indicated by his or her signature on form #34124, Application for Merit Badge, commonly called “The Blue Card.”

I did have an interesting exchange with a scouter on email. He was hoping that the new advancement book was going to fix all these interpretations on issues like MBs, BORs, EPs etc. I said that regardless of what we write in the book, there are going to be those units that will continue to make up their own rules, delay a scouts advancement and add to the requirements. There are redress avenues for the scout and his parent to use to deal with these "leaders" if they choose to do so. If they are happy with the troop's "policies" that contradict National's, then little old me in PA and big old National aren't going to fix it.

[bnelso]

I know that once a MB Counselor signs off on the BC, the badge is earned and a SM can't take it away from the Scout. So why does the SM sign under the MB Counselor on the applicant's record?

[RMM]

I know that once a MB Counselor signs off on the BC, the badge is earned and a SM can't take it away from the Scout. So why does the SM sign under the MB Counselor on the applicant's record?

This is where the unit verifies that the MBC who signed off on the Blue Card is a registered MBC. If not a registered MBC, then the unit should not sign off on the card and direct the Scout to a registered MBC for the merit badge. The unit should also contact the District Advancement Committee and provide them with the contact info of the person who signed off the Blue Card. This is so the District Advancement Committee can get the person registered as a MBC (if appropriate), and advise that until they are registered, they should not be signing Blue Cards.

[razor_strop]

Matt, I stand corrected. Although the BC only uses the words "registered" and "qualified" rather than "authorized" or "approved", and the current ACPP says "signed" rather than "approved" merit badge application, I just reread the Scoutmaster Handbook and under the section on merit badges it does indeed specifically say Scoutmater approval. Oddly enough, that seems to be the only reference that uses the words Scoutmaster approval. Like I mentioned above, neither the BC or the ACPP use "approve" or "approval", nor do the online Scouting.org references that discuss the steps to earning MBs.

So I guess that brings up (for me, anyhow) the question if a Scout asks for a BC to work on a specific MB, can the SM withhold approval and if he does, what recourse does a Scout have? Does Scoutmaster approval imply that a SM could conceivably prevent Scouts in his troop from working on MBs until he feels they're ready, say after they earn 1st Class, or prevent them from working on certain MBs at his own whim? Sure, these would be extreme examples, but they appear to be within policy if the policy uses the term "approval".

[smtroop168]

I know that once a MB Counselor signs off on the BC, the badge is earned and a SM can't take it away from the Scout. So why does the SM sign under the MB Counselor on the applicant's record?

This is where the unit verifies that the MBC who signed off on the Blue Card is a registered MBC. If not a registered MBC, then the unit should not sign off on the card and direct the Scout to a registered MBC for the merit badge. The unit should also contact the District Advancement Committee and provide them with the contact info of the person who signed off the Blue Card. This is so the District Advancement Committee can get the person registered as a MBC (if appropriate), and advise that until they are registered, they should not be signing Blue Cards.

Actually the determination on whether the MBC is registered should occur WAY before the scout brings the SM a completed and signed BC since the SM provided the scout with the name of the MBC in the first place.

If you would find an undocumented MBC, it would be a rare occasion when a Scout would be punished for the failing of an adult. In fact, the documentation could have been approved yet not hit the MBC master list for some reason. Unsuitable counselors or those who do not BSA procedures should be reported the local council.

The SM signs the BC after the MBC to basically close the loop and ask the scout about his experience prior to giving the card to the Advancement chair for processing and obtaining the badge.

[bnelso]

I actully just now read the BC (I know should have done that first) and on the applicant's record page it does seem like it is only an ack from the SM that he has received a completed MB application. It reads:

Name ___________ has given me his completed application for the _____merit badge_________ completed on __/__/__ by _________sig of counselor ______
_______sig of unit leader ___________

[smtroop168]

Matt, I stand corrected. Although the BC only uses the words "registered" and "qualified" rather than "authorized" or "approved", and the current ACPP says "signed" rather than "approved" merit badge application, I just reread the Scoutmaster Handbook and under the section on merit badges it does indeed specifically say Scoutmater approval. Oddly enough, that seems to be the only reference that uses the words Scoutmaster approval. Like I mentioned above, neither the BC or the ACPP use "approve" or "approval", nor do the online Scouting.org references that discuss the steps to earning MBs.

So I guess that brings up (for me, anyhow) the question if a Scout asks for a BC to work on a specific MB, can the SM withhold approval and if he does, what recourse does a Scout have? Does Scoutmaster approval imply that a SM could conceivably prevent Scouts in his troop from working on MBs until he feels they're ready, say after they earn 1st Class, or prevent them from working on certain MBs at his own whim? Sure, these would be extreme examples, but they appear to be within policy if the policy uses the term "approval".

I use this one as the overarching BSA advancement policy:
No council, district, unit, or individual has the authority to add to, or subtract from advancement requirements. Holding a scout hostage to some preconceived opinion that they aren't ready is adding to the requirements. Also since there is no rank restriction on earning MBs he is also adding to the requirements. I would advise the scout to ask for a Board of Review.