Moving to a New Troop

[ASM-142]

I have a 'Life Scout" where his mother jsut told the troop he will be moving to another trrop (only about 2 miles away). This boy is 8 months from turning 18. He has 4 MB left as well as his Eagle project and leadership position.

At his Life BOR he was told he needed to attend Patrol Leader Skills Training (a course offered by our council) to advance any further. He has been reminded by our troop a number of times about this and he just skips attending. How do we tell this other troop (or should we) about his Life BOR decision?

[wagionvigil]

he does not have to attend that to advance. It is not a requirement.

[ASM-142]

I thought that was going to be the answer. I am not sure why the BOR would of advanced him to life if the did not feel he had sufficient leadership qualities at that time that they needed to state he had to go to PLS before his next advancement.

[wagionvigil]

Look at what is required for leadership. Pretty vague.

[JazerNorth]

I have a 'Life Scout" where his mother jsut told the troop he will be moving to another trrop (only about 2 miles away). This boy is 8 months from turning 18. He has 4 MB left as well as his Eagle project and leadership position.

At his Life BOR he was told he needed to attend Patrol Leader Skills Training (a course offered by our council) to advance any further. He has been reminded by our troop a number of times about this and he just skips attending. How do we tell this other troop (or should we) about his Life BOR decision?

I don't know the complete story, but from what you have said, if the BOR doesn't advance him because he hasn't gone to Patrol Leader Training, I would appeal to the Council.

If the boy performed his leadership duties, led his patrol, then he is good to go for the leadership reqs. If he didn't do his duties, and it wasn't due to the error of the scoutmaster or SPL, then the BOR was right to not advance, but wrong to assign addtional requirement of attending the training session.

My Soap Box.... climbing down off now.

JazerNorth

[wagionvigil]

No soap box you were just stating the BSA method

[ASM-142]

If he didn't do his duties, and it wasn't due to the error of the scoutmaster or SPL, then the BOR was right to not advance, but wrong to assign addtional requirement of attending the training session.

My Soap Box.... climbing down off now.

JazerNorth

The BOR did advance him to Life even though he did not fulfill his leadership requirements. The former SM and Committee advanced this boy as a going away present to the new leadership even though he did not satisfy the requirements for this ran (nor previous ranks from knowing this boy).

I am grateful at this point that this scout has decided to move onto another troop and let them decide if he has earned Eagle or not.

[Scouting179]

The new troop won't know anything about this unless someone tells them.

[Mrw]

My experience has been that moving to a new troop is absolutely the best was to slow down progress towards the next rank.

To get settled in a new troop, get a leadership position and be there long enought for them to know the boy yakes probably longer than the 6-8 months he has left to finish all the requirements.

This would be regardless of whether the new troop is told anything about the boy in advance.

I would suggest though, that if you are asked, don't say anything bad about the scout that could come back to haunt you. Let the recommendation be telling in its omission of good features rather than inclusion of uncomplimentary features. For example, saying only, "yes, he was in our troop for three years." Rather that saying, "Yes, he was in our troop and wasn't much of a leader in what we asked him to do!" Be honest, but not mean about it. This is the same as employee recommendations. Our company will only acknowledge employment, but it can be said in a positive or negative manner.

[Rick Tyler]

At his Life BOR he was told he needed to attend Patrol Leader Skills Training (a course offered by our council) to advance any further. He has been reminded by our troop a number of times about this and he just skips attending. How do we tell this other troop (or should we) about his Life BOR decision?

I am about to vent. Rest assured that this is not aimed at you, 142. I know you know better than this, just look at your signature line.

First, you should all collectively keep your mouths shut -- except to say that he's a fine young man and you'll miss him. There's some chance that his new troop might have someone who is actually trained and then your troop will become the laughingstock of the district for trying to enforce a stupid, ill-advised, non-BSA requirement for advancement. Have you taken this up with the committee? (As in, "Please show me in the Boy Scout Handbook where this course is a requirement for Eagle Scout?")

Second, I sure hope your committee has required every single Eagle candidate in your troop to take this same course. At least that would be consistent. Dead wrong -- but consistent.

Third, this isn't nearly difficult enough for someone of true "Eagle caliber." Make him swim a wide crocodile-filled river wearing a blindfold and towing a canoe filled with your troop committee. That would show real Eagle skills! (And maybe the crocs will go for the boat instead of the Scout...)

The more experienced I get in Scouting, the more disgusted I get with adults who create artificial barriers to a Scout's success.

[wagionvigil]

Rick you are right on target. It's those troop rules again.

[Eamonn]

It is a shame that so many well meaning adults with good intentions seem to want to change or alter the BSA requirements.
What we agree to do when we sign on as leaders is not that hard.
We need to remember that we don't own the program, we just deliver it.
At times I wish that my mail man would sort through my mail and take out all the bad news and all the bills, but that's not his job. All he has to do is deliver the mail.
While I have never worked for the USPS, I'm sure that before they put the mail in my mail box someone reads the address in order to make sure it ends up in the right mail box.
Reading the material that we have available and following it, isn't that hard.

[riverwalk]

Well, some of us don't get the right mail in our mailbox, haha, but I understand. The biggest barrier to getting Scouters to perform in their Position, is failure to Train or follow same, IMHO, haha.

[Lynda J]

If Comittee members and Scoutmasters would learn to teach from the BSA program and stop trying to "improve it" their troops would run much better.

In my over 40 years of working as an adult in both Girl and Boy Scouts the biggest problems have always been with adults.
So many seem to have this need to make rules. They seem to think that these "young men" should be leading as adults. Well guess what they are not adults. Leadership is a slow learning process.

BSA is pretty specific in that you can not add requirements for advancement or on badge work. The boys must do the requirements but can not be made to do additional requirements.

One the hardest things I am always running into as a Unit Commissioner is troops and packs making Unit Rules. And to be honest those are always the units that are in trouble and are losing boys.

There is no requirement that a boy must attend any type of leadership training in order to advance any rank, and this includes Eagle. As a Troop Committee if you put that requirement in and do not advance him in rank you are breaking all BSA rules relating to advancement.

If this boy is moving to another troop, you had better hope he doesn't complain about your troop adding requirements for advancement. Because if he does it will be your troop that is in trouble. Not him.

[riverwalk]

KISMIF

[ASM-142]

There's some chance that his new troop might have someone who is actually trained and then your troop will become the laughingstock of the district for trying to enforce a stupid, ill-advised, non-BSA requirement for advancement. Have you taken this up with the committee? (As in, "Please show me in the Boy Scout Handbook where this course is a requirement for Eagle Scout?").

Rick,

The troop committee and SM at the time were trained (almost 20+years ago) but did not stay active in training. Thet were also very big in troop rules. Since the BOR decision to advance this scout but with the caveat of needing PLS training for future advancement, I was not sure if this needed to be enforced. This decision is something that the scout (and his family) accepted at the time. For the scout not to do the training it does not show his ability to live his life in accordance with the principles of scouting.

The new SM and committee and now currently trained and understand the no troop rules policy. This is the way the troop will continue to run as long as I am involved.