Question on Square Knots

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Kobalt
Star

Joined: 12 Jul 2004
Posts: 98
Location: Louisville, KY
Posted: 15 Jul 2004 01:45 pm Post subject: Question on
Square Knots

Are there any good sites on the Square Knot Awards that you
can receive as an adult? My troop is wanting me to make a web
page, and I am having trouble finding information on this
subject. Any help would be appreciated.
_________________
John Baunach
Troop 42
"If it were easy, it would have been done before." -Jeana
Yeager, co-pilot of Voyager

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fgoodwin
Scout

Joined: 15 Jul 2004
Posts: 3
Location: San Antonio, TX
Posted: 15 Jul 2004 03:36 pm Post subject: Re: Question on
Square Knots

Kobalt wrote:
Are there any good sites on the Square Knot Awards that
you can receive as an adult? My troop is wanting me to
make a web page, and I am having trouble finding
information on this subject. Any help would be
appreciated.

Here's a good source:

http://www.usscouts.org/awards/knots2.html

Fred Goodwin
ACM, Pack 2003
Alamo Area Council

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Firefish
Life

Joined: 05 Jul 2004
Posts: 145
Location: Beaver, Pa
Posted: 16 Jul 2004 08:53 am Post subject:

come again?

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ScoutmasterBob
Counselor

Joined: 07 Jul 2004
Posts: 73
Location: Woods Cross, Utah
Posted: 16 Jul 2004 10:38 am Post subject:

I am from the Great Salt Lake Council. Our web site has the
awards listed on the website and they also have the scorecards
for the awards in pdf format for you to download.

The url is www.gslc-bsa.org
Dont forget the religious scouting awards, they have a
corresponding knot as well. Contact your church leader for
info.
_________________
Bob Torkelson
Scoutmaster Troop 538
www.wx5troop538.homestead.com
Live The Oath!

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Kobalt
Star

Joined: 12 Jul 2004
Posts: 98
Location: Louisville, KY
Posted: 16 Jul 2004 04:13 pm Post subject:

Thank you very much, fgoodwin and ScoutmasterBob. I'll be sure
to dig up all the information from your sites (they are very
useful). Boy, do I have a long road ahead of me!
_________________
John Baunach
Troop 42
"If it were easy, it would have been done before." -Jeana
Yeager, co-pilot of Voyager

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Firefish
Life

Joined: 05 Jul 2004
Posts: 145
Location: Beaver, Pa
Posted: 24 Jul 2004 06:48 pm Post subject:

what is the square knot award? I think i have heard of it but
I cant remember
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Peter Cahill
Troop 469
A Fighting Irish

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wagionvigil
Counselor

Joined: 21 Jul 2004
Posts: 187
Location: PA
Posted: 24 Jul 2004 06:57 pm Post subject: square knots

Lets see there is an Arrow of Light Knot, and Eagle Knot,
Youth and Adult Religious Award Knots etc etc. They are worn
in lew of the awards themselves
_________________
Action Center D Rappel Tower Director 2001 and 2005 National
Jamborees
Northeast REgion Area 4 Venturing Chairman
Wagion 6 Lodge Advisor 96-99
"If you ain't A bear you're a Meal"

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Firefish
Life

Joined: 05 Jul 2004
Posts: 145
Location: Beaver, Pa
Posted: 25 Jul 2004 07:36 am Post subject:

ok, I think some people I know are planning on getting a group
to gether and doing our religious award
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Peter Cahill
Troop 469
A Fighting Irish

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Kobalt
Star

Joined: 12 Jul 2004
Posts: 98
Location: Louisville, KY
Posted: 25 Jul 2004 03:20 pm Post subject:

Um, okay... that's good to know.
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John Baunach
Troop 42
"If it were easy, it would have been done before." -Jeana
Yeager, co-pilot of Voyager

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Firefish
Life

Joined: 05 Jul 2004
Posts: 145
Location: Beaver, Pa
Posted: 26 Jul 2004 12:33 pm Post subject:

sorry I know I post nonesense stuff sometimes just its like in
my nature. Kobalt have you gone to heratage reservation for
summer camp?
_________________
Peter Cahill
Troop 469
A Fighting Irish

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Kobalt
Star

Joined: 12 Jul 2004
Posts: 98
Location: Louisville, KY
Posted: 27 Jul 2004 08:12 am Post subject:

It's okay, fish. No I have not. What is it?
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John Baunach
Troop 42
"If it were easy, it would have been done before." -Jeana
Yeager, co-pilot of Voyager

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cballman
Second Class

Joined: 27 Jul 2004
Posts: 18
Location: Nicholasville KY
Posted: 27 Jul 2004 10:12 pm Post subject: Square Knots

Yes there are the arrow of light and eagle knots which I wore
for quite a while by themselves. Then my son wanted to be in
cub scouts and then our cub pack pushed for trained leaders
and awarded the other knots for leadership and training. most
of the knots require at least 1 year and roundtable trainin
sessions tio help out with the scouting program. All of the
req. are out on the meritbadge.com site or usscouts.org site.
I have now been active for quite a few years and now proudly
wear 4 more for leadership and training so now that i proudly
wear 6 knots and get ask about them so we can get trained
leadersfor our kids. because every scout deserves a trained
leader.
_________________
Charlie Ballman
ASM Troop 41 Lexington KY

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ScoutmasterBob
Counselor

Joined: 07 Jul 2004
Posts: 73
Location: Woods Cross, Utah
Posted: 29 Jul 2004 11:55 am Post subject:

I have seen leaders that have 15 knots on their shirts, and I
have heard some leaders say "what a show off" or "I dont have
to wear knots to show my accomplishments".

The knots you wear are more than just for show, they show not
only the fact that you took the time to do the requirements to
earn them, but they show that you have a genuine commitment to
the scouting program and are willing to learn to become a
better leader.

Wear those knots with pride, wheather it be one or 15, show
your commitment to scouting.
_________________
Bob Torkelson
Scoutmaster Troop 538
www.wx5troop538.homestead.com
Live The Oath!

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wagionvigil
Counselor

Joined: 21 Jul 2004
Posts: 187
Location: PA
Posted: 29 Jul 2004 03:44 pm Post subject:

I truthfully say I have only worked for two awards Eagle in
1963 and Wood Badge in 1967 and 1991. Everything else just
happened. I forgot my God and Country in 1963 also so 3
awards. My idea is I am here for the boys I could care less
about awards for me BUt if they Happen it is nice also. My
father got SIlver Beaver in 1976 I got SB in 1996 after he
passed away But it meant alot.
_________________
Action Center D Rappel Tower Director 2001 and 2005 National
Jamborees
Northeast REgion Area 4 Venturing Chairman
Wagion 6 Lodge Advisor 96-99
"If you ain't A bear you're a Meal"

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ScoutmasterBob
Counselor

Joined: 07 Jul 2004
Posts: 73
Location: Woods Cross, Utah
Posted: 30 Jul 2004 10:13 am Post subject:

wagionvigil said:
Quote:
My idea is I am here for the boys I could care less
about awards for me BUt if they Happen it is nice also.

I think you should strive to earn the awards that are
available for your position. Just like we encourage our scouts
to aim for Eagle, we as leaders should aim for Scoutmaster Key
or the Leadership training award just to name a few.
They dont just give these away, you need to earn them, and
when you earn them make sure they are presented in front of
your scouts at a Court of Honor, I think it is important for
them to see you, their leader, working and achieving scout
awards just like we ask them to.

Make sure you wear your awards, knots for every day, but if
there is a corresponding medal that goes with your knot, wear
them for COH.
I earned my Eagle 21 years ago, and I always wear my Eagle
medal to COH along with others that I have earned. I have
sometimes been called the "Scouting General" by some of the
parents of my scouts, because I wear my medals. I want the
scouts to be proud of their accomplishments and not be
embarrassed to show off what they have done.

Leaders should be proud of their accomplishments as well.

In my opinion, of course.
_________________
Bob Torkelson
Scoutmaster Troop 538
www.wx5troop538.homestead.com
Live The Oath!

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wagionvigil
Counselor

Joined: 21 Jul 2004
Posts: 187
Location: PA
Posted: 30 Jul 2004 10:31 am Post subject:

My Eagle goes on for Each COH I Attend and MY SB for The
Special Occasions at COuncil Dinners Etc. I have 11 Knots and
It is interesting when the Boys ask what they stand for and
then you explain. I always take the time and answer the
questions that go along with it. SOmtimes when there are more
than one boy they make a game out of it as to who can guess
the most.
_________________
Action Center D Rappel Tower Director 2001 and 2005 National
Jamborees
Northeast REgion Area 4 Venturing Chairman
Wagion 6 Lodge Advisor 96-99
"If you ain't A bear you're a Meal"

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optimist
Advancement Chairman

Joined: 27 Jun 2004
Posts: 118

Posted: 31 Jul 2004 07:07 pm Post subject:

The square knots and other awards for adults serve the same
purpose as merit badges and ranks for Scouts. It's
recognition. It's designed to encourage greater
self-improvement and further involvement within the program.

There is quite a lot of negativity surrounding these programs
and I must admit that this has affected my opinion in the
past. My opinion is quite simple now. Anything that encourages
more adult involvement and training is a good thing therefore
the knots are a good thing.

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Kobalt
Star

Joined: 12 Jul 2004
Posts: 98
Location: Louisville, KY
Posted: 31 Jul 2004 10:18 pm Post subject:

What sort of negativity surrounds the knots? Something like
they make the leaders more focused on themselves than the
troop, or what? Just wondering.
_________________
John Baunach
Troop 42
"If it were easy, it would have been done before." -Jeana
Yeager, co-pilot of Voyager

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cballman
Second Class

Joined: 27 Jul 2004
Posts: 18
Location: Nicholasville KY
Posted: 01 Aug 2004 09:59 am Post subject: knots

When you see a leader with more than three knots on the
uniform sometimes other leaders look at them and think that
the person is like an untouchable or untalkable leader. but if
you know about most of the knots they are for a leasdership
position AND training. In our troop and most recently our cub
scout pack we have a motto tjat sounds like a broken record
but here it is

"every scout deserves a trained leader"

not only do I try to make sure that we trained leaders but
then again how do we become better leaders?? we use our
council traing programs to help with the training. then a good
leader will use it to award the knots to leaders who have
earned them. believe me the awarding of these help moral out
with some leaders.
_________________
Charlie Ballman
ASM Troop 41 Lexington KY

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wagionvigil
Counselor

Joined: 21 Jul 2004
Posts: 187
Location: PA
Posted: 01 Aug 2004 10:21 am Post subject:

Charlie you are correct. Training is the most important aspect
of a good program. But training does not stop after Basic!
Monthly Roundtables are extremely important,POW WOWS for Cub
leaders Wood Badge, Philmont TRaining ( fantastic) for all
positions. Visiting other units that have good programs,
attending the National Jamboree, yes I consider that training
also. Going to Camp School for any type of training. There are
many oportunities for more and better training.
_________________
Action Center D Rappel Tower Director 2001 and 2005 National
Jamborees
Northeast REgion Area 4 Venturing Chairman
Wagion 6 Lodge Advisor 96-99
"If you ain't A bear you're a Meal"

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ScoutmasterBob
Counselor

Joined: 07 Jul 2004
Posts: 73
Location: Woods Cross, Utah
Posted: 02 Aug 2004 10:22 am Post subject:

I agree with wagionvigil, training is an on going thing.
A lot of leaders that I have worked with think that once you
have done basic training you never have to do it again.
At roundtable we ask for a show of hands as to who has been
trained and a few hands go up, then we ask how long has it
been since you have attended basic training. A few will say 10
years or more, but I have done it .
Training is always available somewhere.
Why would you try to do a job with out knowing what to do or
how to do it, it is a recipe for failure.
Training,training,training. Its not easy, but your scout
programs will be better if you are trained.
_________________
Bob Torkelson
Scoutmaster Troop 538
www.wx5troop538.homestead.com
Live The Oath!

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Guneukitschik
Life

Joined: 02 Aug 2004
Posts: 155
Location: Waynesboro, PA
Posted: 06 Aug 2004 08:33 am Post subject:

Here is a different question regarding square knots....

What about a Venture crew leader that earned the Eagle award,
Arrow of Light, etc as a youth and on the Tan BSA uniform the
square knots are on a tan background and match the uniform.
However these square knots I would assume could be worn on the
Green Venturing uniform but the background is still tan? I
don't believe that the BSA is producing these knots with a
green background? I have seen other sources for purchasing the
knots with a green background...which is correct?

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wagionvigil
Counselor

Joined: 21 Jul 2004
Posts: 187
Location: PA
Posted: 06 Aug 2004 08:39 am Post subject:

You wear the BSA supllied knots. They are official and a
Venturing Uniform is an official uniform.
_________________
Action Center D Rappel Tower Director 2001 and 2005 National
Jamborees
Northeast REgion Area 4 Venturing Chairman
Wagion 6 Lodge Advisor 96-99
"If you ain't A bear you're a Meal"

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Guneukitschik
Life

Joined: 02 Aug 2004
Posts: 155
Location: Waynesboro, PA
Posted: 06 Aug 2004 09:14 am Post subject:

You are correct..but they look? well...I think odd is the
correct word! I know that they have made knots with different
backgrounds for sea scouts, etc... I wonder why they wouldn't
do the same for the venturing uniform?
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wagionvigil
Counselor

Joined: 21 Jul 2004
Posts: 187
Location: PA
Posted: 06 Aug 2004 09:21 am Post subject:

SInce the Program is growing they may do that. Alot of things
happen after NJ's are over. We will see.
_________________
Action Center D Rappel Tower Director 2001 and 2005 National
Jamborees
Northeast REgion Area 4 Venturing Chairman
Wagion 6 Lodge Advisor 96-99
"If you ain't A bear you're a Meal"

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Guneukitschik
Life

Joined: 02 Aug 2004
Posts: 155
Location: Waynesboro, PA
Posted: 06 Aug 2004 09:35 am Post subject:

You are correct about that....I think on the national website
they have a poll as to what uniform changes you would like to
see or not see.

There is still the dispute over whether you can wear just the
tan uniform with the green epaulets or wear the green uniform.

I guess we'll just have to wait and see!
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