Adult Square Knots Again

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Rick Tyler
Scout

Joined: 07 Aug 2004
Posts: 7
Location: Redmond, Washington
Posted: 07 Aug 2004 07:50 am Post subject: Adult Square
Knots Again

Anyone at the campfire have an opinion of a Boy Scout leader
wearing Cub Scout training awards on his/her uniform?

FWIW, I don't know if I care one way or the other, but I do
think it can look a little jarring sometimes.
_________________
Yis,

Rick Tyler
ASM, Troop 571
Chief Seattle Council
Troop MB Chancellor and Admiral of the Troop Fleet

Last edited by Rick Tyler on 07 Aug 2004 09:31 am; edited 1
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Kobalt
Star

Joined: 12 Jul 2004
Posts: 98
Location: Louisville, KY
Posted: 07 Aug 2004 08:51 am Post subject:

I didn't think that was legal... unless I'm misunderstanding
the question. The only Cub Scout Award you can wear on your
uniform is the Arrow of Light.
_________________
John Baunach
Troop 42
"If it were easy, it would have been done before." -Jeana
Yeager, co-pilot of Voyager

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BM_Crawford
Star

Joined: 12 Jul 2004
Posts: 125
Location: PA W/F Council
Posted: 07 Aug 2004 08:56 am Post subject:

I think your right Kobalt
_________________
Brian Crawford
Troop 251

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Rick Tyler
Scout

Joined: 07 Aug 2004
Posts: 7
Location: Redmond, Washington
Posted: 07 Aug 2004 09:35 am Post subject:

There are three awards a youth can earn as a Cub and wear on
their Boy Scout uniform: the Arrow of light, medals for
heroism, and the religious award.

I was referring to adult uniforms in my first post. I
sometimes see adult Boy Scout leaders with Cub Scout training
and service square knots on their uniforms.
_________________
Yis,

Rick Tyler
ASM, Troop 571
Chief Seattle Council
Troop MB Chancellor and Admiral of the Troop Fleet

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wagionvigil
Counselor

Joined: 21 Jul 2004
Posts: 187
Location: PA
Posted: 07 Aug 2004 01:33 pm Post subject:

Once an award is earned You may and should always wear the
knot. If it were another way. I have the scouters key which I
earned before I was involved in Cubs. Should I be required to
remove it? Not!
When there were Two Wood Badge courses people would say you
could not wear your beads earned in the Cub Program if you
were working with a scout troop. But it was OK to wear Beads
earned with a Scout Troop if you were working with Cubs. This
was totally untrue and not a rule only a Legend. There again
People making up rules.
_________________
Action Center D Rappel Tower Director 2001 and 2005 National
Jamborees
Northeast REgion Area 4 Venturing Chairman
Wagion 6 Lodge Advisor 96-99
"If you ain't A bear you're a Meal"

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ScoutmasterBob
Counselor

Joined: 07 Jul 2004
Posts: 73
Location: Woods Cross, Utah
Posted: 07 Aug 2004 01:51 pm Post subject:

I agree, it is ok to wear the awards you earn on your uniform,
whether it be cubs, scouts, varsity, venture.
I know the OA has a knot, i have even earned a knot on the
district level as a member of the roundtable staff and I was
still a scoutmaster at the time.
Tell me Rick, is there any reason you dont think the cub
awards should not be worn buy a boy scout leader, if he earned
them properly?
_________________
Bob Torkelson
Scoutmaster Troop 538
www.wx5troop538.homestead.com
Live The Oath!

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Guneukitschik
Life

Joined: 02 Aug 2004
Posts: 155
Location: Waynesboro, PA
Posted: 09 Aug 2004 06:55 am Post subject:

I would have to agree....once you've earned it....wear it
proudly!
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http://www.bsatroop88.org

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dparker
Scout

Joined: 08 Aug 2004
Posts: 3
Location: Atwater, California
Posted: 09 Aug 2004 07:10 pm Post subject: Adult Awards

I also think that the knots should be worn, regardless of what
program they were earned in. I love to talk to the people that
a lot of Scout experience and knots are a good first indicator
of a person's exposure to Scouting.

I do know some leaders that will only wear knots they earned
as youth. They feel it is intimidating to others or showing
off to wear any more. I respect how they feel, but I also
believe recognition is a great way to thank those people who
contribute.

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Guneukitschik
Life

Joined: 02 Aug 2004
Posts: 155
Location: Waynesboro, PA
Posted: 10 Aug 2004 02:28 pm Post subject:

I was reading somewhere that the Scoutmaster Award of Merit
which is the all white knot on the tan background was a carry
over from the old NESA sponsored president's award and that
the plan was to aid in keeping Scoutmasters around for an
additional year of service... the article said that the
average tenure for a scoutmaster was 4 years and this was
meant to extend it to 5 years.

The award is fairly simple to get...the committee chairman and
spl must write letters of recomendation...fill out a brief
application and there is only 18 month tenure required on the
scoutmasters part along with some other easy requirements.
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[riverwalk]

Yes, of course one can wear any knot they qualify for, though only one of each. That's where the little Devices come in, to indicate each Program you earned an Award. Because there are different colors of official BSA Uniform shirts, some knots may appear to stand out more because the background doesn't match the shirt. Some people like the "aftermarket" patches that match their shirt, and these are often tolerated in local Councils. But a Scouter isn't wrong to wear an official knot on an official shirt. Some Scouters don't wear any of their knots. But they may qualify for several.

Yeah, the Scoutmaster OR Advisor Award (same knot - different device) appears to have been introduced to recognize Leaders more quickly (earlier) in their tenure in one of those positions. If they are doing what happens to be the requirements, then it's the Youth and Unit that benefit. That's why the Leader isn't the one recommending he/she gets the Award. It also seems it was based on one "local" knot known as the "Why knot"...to recognize in the same way.

[teepeeayy]

When I joined this forum, I thought I did a pretty good job reading old posts so I didn't appear to be too much of a "newbie" and have people respond "read the FAQ". I'm glad this was newly responded to because I just earned the Cubmaster and Scouter knots. I am now an assistant SM, not in the Pack anymore. Someone I thought was in the know told me it was "discouraged" to wear knots earned in the Pack once you move on to a troop.

I will proudly wear my knots on the shirt with my Assistant Scout Master patch.

(I knew there was a reason to keep coming back to this forum)

[RWSmith]

Someone I thought was in the know told me it was "discouraged" to wear knots earned in the Pack once you move on to a troop.

Aaaannnt!

I will proudly wear my knots on the shirt with my Assistant Scout Master patch.

Good for you. We adults need recognition just like kids do. Can we go overboard sometimes, just like kids can? Yeah, so what? We're human. It's important that our kids see us [as humans] continuing to strive for and, yes, modestly accepting awards for attaining some of those goals (or honors, you know, those kind that you can't just check off).

It speaks volumes.. it says to them, "Hey, this Boy Scout thing is more than just some stupid game of 'I've got more patches than you!' Setting goals and striving for them is not just a part of life; it's a part of living."

[abfelts]

I earned the webelos leader award back the 80's and I feel proud to wear it along side of my knots, the scoutmaster key, district award of merit,
distinguished commissioner, silver beaver ect, in all as of now I have ten knots and I wear eight of them. I am a district commissioner and when I visit the units I let them know that they to can earn knots and be proud to wear them, remember the only pay we get is to help our youth and leaders and if we get a little reward by earning knots and wearing them.
If you see a leader with training knots then you know what they say is true. our youth are getting a trained leader. abfelts

[Chief J]

I would like to express my opinion on knots and ask leaders how they get recognized. I am a SM in my Troop and CC for the Cub Pack.

In these positions I make it a point to recommend my ASM's and Pack Leaders for any training awards, and other merit awards for which they are qualified for. What get's my goat are the number of leaders who have to "put in" there own paperwork for some sort of recognition.

It seems in the District to which I belong, the only way you receive any recognition of the job you are doing is to fill the paperwork out yourself and turn it in. As leader's supervising other adult volunteers (i.e., SM, or CC) I think you owe it your adults to file the paperwork for any and all awards to which they are entitled.

Once they are recognized, it is up to them if they want to sew the things on.

Opinions for what they are worth,
Chief J

[ilduncans]

The knots are part of how we promote a quality program. The knots are how we demonstrate that, as leaders, we are willing, even happy to perform those things expected of us to deliver the highest possible quality of program.

Do you have to wear them all? Certainly not (with a few exceptions). Choose the ones that most represent the part of the program you want to promote to your fellow leaders.