First Class Swimming

[wagionvigil]

What I would Like To See Is
Swimming
Lifesaving
And Nothing after like Emerg. Prepardness etc.
Those two Required with NO optional MB If you do not have swimming and Lifesaving you cannot make Eagle.
That is what I would Like to see.

[cballman]

just like back in the old days before the hippie era of the mid 70s when the skill awards just began. I think unfortunelty like wagionvigil there is just some things that shouldnt be messed with. there must be First aid, Swimming, Lifesaving that must be required and no exceptions. because those three merit badges pretty much sum up the majority of what most people see the scouts that have made the news with lifesaving skills. now if yall want to disagree thats fine but this is my humble opinion of someone who has helped pull a couple of bodies out of the water.

[deweylure]

Sorry ,I mis understood you post Wagionvigil.

Dewey

[Chief J]

Getting a little right of the topic, but restating my earlier post. I too feel that Swimming and Lifesaving need to be required with no options. The world is covered with water and these individuals may find themselves in it someday and need to save themselves.

In the news here in Pittsburgh, they have searched for and/or recovered at least 4 bodies in the last 5 days from our Rivers, as well as a near drowning of a five year old in a backyard pool.

Swimming and Lifesaving will provide you the basis of respecting the water. I do not feel you can "Be Prepared" if you cannot swim. Alot of good being able to Hike or Bike when your buddy goes overboard on the river.

I understand many people have a fear of water, they need to work on this fear and get over it. This can be done with patience, understanding, and instruction.

Just my Opinion for what it's worth.
Chief J

[deweylure]

In my earlier post I mentioned I had a few scouts who could not pass the test 100 yds. One being my son. Well he did get off the computer and to my amazement passed his 100yds. Another boy who took lessons last year swam it like he was going for an Olympic gold. The 3rd actually made 50 feet . His said he was afraid of the water,funny thing he remained in the pool all night. I did find out the real problem. The boys are self conscious due to adolescent body changes and being teased. I spoke with my son and suggested he ignore the comments by other kids.
It appears he spoke with his friend and they both agreed to ignore negative comments. It seems there could be physical or mental challenges to the boys. Overcoming them or adapting to them really gives a young man the feeling of accomplishment. I am very proud as a parent and a leader of all my scouts.

We also conducted life saving. An ASM is a BSA lifeguard and I was the rescue dummy.

I guess I changed my mind. It seems hard work ,growing physically and some encouragement by the other scouts helped the boys get thru. We did urge all the boys keep swimming to strengthen and practice up on other strokes.

Dewey

[wagionvigil]

glad this happened. keep them in the water

[Chief J]

Wonderful, congratulations to you and your scouts for not giving in.

Swimming is too important a life skill not to learn.

Keep up the good work,
Chief J

[mhjacobson]

Unfortunately many of the posters regarding the issues of dealing with a person who has a true phobia of water do not seem to have the program right. The issues as are follows:
1. Like it or not, BSA has a policy that were there is a physical or mental condition that hampers a scout's ability to complete a reguirement as follows he has the right to either an accommodation or modification to the requirement;
2. A true phobia is not something that easily can be unlearned and may take years of psychotherapy to be corrected, if at all;
3. It takes more than a letter from a physician to state that there is a phobia that would lead to a consideration of an alteraction, accommodation, or substitution of a requirement -- it would take a detailed report from a person licensed to practice psychology or psychiatry;
4. Once the report is received, an Individual Scout Advancement Plan is to be completed -- this report will contain the reason for the change to the requirement, and the recommended change; and
5. The documentation that was received by the unit, along with the ISAP, is forwarded by the scout unit to the Council Advancement Committee via District Advancement Committee for review and approval.

Only with the approval of the Council Advancement Committee can a requirement be modified for any rank or merit badge requirement. The Counsil Advancement Committee usually will confer with the Council Scouting for the Disabled Committee for advice in the matter.

Thus, it is not for the individual scouter, or the individual scout unit to make the decision. If the appropriately licensed medical provider profers a diagnosis, it is the responsibility of the unit to send it up and let the appropriate scout committee to make the decision.

[Double Eagle]

mhjacobson,

I agree with your post except the following: "Only with the approval of the Council Advancement Committee can a requirement be modified for any rank or merit badge requirement. The Council Advancement Committee usually will confer with the Council Scouting for the Disabled Committee for advice in the matter."

Merit badge requirements may not be modified. Alternate merit badges may be approved for Eagle Required merit badges but the requirements must be met as stated.

[mhjacobson]

Sorry, but what I was trying to state is that they can modify the merit badge requirements for a rank. However they can also state "how" a particular requirement for a merit badge can be met. They can not substitute a requirement for completion for a merit badge!

[fritz1255]

My son (age 13, been in Scouts for two years) FINALLY passed his swim test at Camp this summer, and will be gettng his First Class award at the Court of Honor tonight. I was really despairing of him passing, and was prepared to pay for a YMCA membership and swimming lessons if he was not successful at Camp. He did not want to do this, since he would probably would have been taking lessons with kids in the 6 to 8 year old range.

In his case, what made him succeed this time when he failed before was physical maturity - he has grown, is stronger, and far better able to coordinate his movements now. So for all parents who had the same experience that I did - hang in there, the situation may resolve itself.

He was one of the first in his age group to achieve Second Class about a year and a half ago, but most of the others have passed him up now. Assuming he gets his service hours, he should be getting his Star rank in the Spring (already has more than enough Merit badges). Now we need to work on Swimming Merit Badge......

[wagionvigil]

That is the way to do it. Give him a hearty well done!

[lifescoutforlife]

Congrats to him! I had a hard time myself learning to swim, good luck to him on the swimming MB.

[Chief J]

Congratulations to your son! That's the way to stick with it.

Wish him my best on the swimming merit badge.

Chief J

[Wapiti]

This is not an issue for us quite yet, but it is going to come up soon.

I know the swimming requirement can be waived for safety and/or disability reasons.

My youngest son is a 2nd year Webelos; he also has epilepsy and he is on medication, since he was 6 years old.

What are the chances of this requirement being waived?

[wagionvigil]

It can be waived with a Doctors report.
Has a Doctor ever said he must never swim?

[FrankJ]

My youngest son is a 2nd year Webelos; he also has epilepsy and he is on medication, since he was 6 years old.

That is very much a council decision. Epilepsy by itself is not a barrier to swimming, so unless there are other factors involved, it wouldn't be a reason.

[WeeWillie]

Be advised that if your son obtains a waiver for swimming for rank advancement, that does not mean that he has a waiver from the swimming test required for aquatics merit badges and skill badges such as Motor Boating, Small Boat Sailing, Rowing, Canoeing, Rowing, Board Sailing.....

I have a Scout with one lung. He was waived for Swiming Merit Badge, Dive for an Object. But he did all the rest. He practiced and last Summer he earned Canoeing.

[Wapiti]

My concern, as far as my son having epilepsy, is having a seizure while in the water. Just yesterday, he had 3 small ones.

If he can't drive because of his disability, I don't see how he be forced into the water unattended, where drowning is a real possibility.

I will say this, he can swim, but he's always had private lessons, where the instructor is only focused on him. I take him to the pool, but I'm always watching him & I'm never more than about 5 strokes from him, in case he does have a seizure. Plus, I was a Red Cross certified lifeguard in high school.

My concern is that the Troop his older brother is in, they do their Aquatics at summer camp, and I know that they don't have the staff to focus only on one child.

As far as the other aquatic related MBs, he would have to avoid them, and he can substitute Hiking for Swimming. It's just the price he has to pay for his disability.

[mhjacobson]

Acutally the method of obtaining a waiver of a requirement (and the substitution of a new requirement -- a requirement is not just waivered) is to get all of the supporting medical information from the appropriate medical practitioner, have the troop write up an Individual Scout Advamcement Plan for the rank in question, and submit the medical information and the Plan in a packet to the Council Advancement Committee. Only the Council Advancement Committee has the authority to waive a requirement and approve the substitution.