BSA v. Organized Sports

[616kayak]

No Boy Scouts isn't boot camp. They don't teach the Scout Laws in boot camp. ...

Boot camps and JROTC teach the values of the scout law. Read the Army JROTC Cadet Creed and you will see this.

[pipestone1991]

^^yes, just in a more....err.....disciplined manner

[wagionvigil]

Yeah! physical Punishment for one!

[616kayak]

Yeah! physical Punishment for one!

Yes, we do have cadets do pushups if they are not following rules. (ex. 50 pushups for profanity) But, Asking a cadet to do 50 pushups is the equivalent of asking a scout to tie a bowline.
Mainly, it removes the cadet from the situation and corrects him. This is also not done too often.

Scouting and JROTC share a common purpose that is to motivate young people to become better citizens.

[ICanCanoeCanU]

Just getting back to comments I made on page 3 of this thread.

Found out last night, that our council is NOW accepting MBC applications and having people register with the council but not forcing registration to a troop. This is new just this year. This will be a nice benefit and I'm glad for the change.

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Edit by RWSmith...

See: http://www.meritbadge.net/phpbb/viewtopic.php?t=2238

[mhjacobson]

If you want scouting to win against sport, PLAN, PLAN, PLAN an exciting compelling program and not make it a scouting vs sports battle. In the case cited above the troop should have simply congratulated the scout on the pending championship game and offered to refund the camp fees, if the camp would refund them to the troop. The worse thing that a troop can do is to create a bad taste in the scout's (and his parent's) mouth that could result in the scout leaving the troop for a more 'friendly' one.

[Chief J]

Yeah! physical Punishment for one!

More PT Sir, More PT, we like it, we love, we want more of it, make it hurt Drill Sergeant, make it hurt.


-Sorry, I couldn't resist this.

-Chief J

[longhorneagle]

We have many scouts who think that they have to choose either sports or scouts if they are going to be successful in one. I noticed that most of our Eagle Scouts participate and excel in not only scouting, but also in sports.

[LSR]

I taught in a very poor, mostly Black, rural school district for four years after leaving the USAF. After that, I worked in the admissions office of a state university that was an HBCU (Historically Black College or University.) Those experiences, quite far removed from my own middle class upbringing, have lead me to be very skeptical of the value of high school sports (football and basketball in particular.)

Take a look at the FIVE YEAR graduation rates for athletes in Div I schools. It's terrible. Look further in the stats broken down by sport, so that the women's tennis team doesn't obscure the men's basketball team. (Women's sports and minor men's sports tend to have better graduation rates.) There are more than a few Div I schools who have not graduated a black male basketball player in ten years!

Several of the kids I taught in junior high were athletes, some quite gifted. I'm thinking of three of my former students who had superb high school football careers and who all landed Div I scholarships. None of them have a degree almost ten years out. Nobodies playing pro ball either. Scouting would have been a much better ticket out. Some of thew scouts in my district play ball, some don't. I don't know of any who view sports as "the way out."

One thing I'm doing in my district is getting to know the Scouts, particuarly the older ones, and asking them what their post HS plans are. If I can help smooth the way, I'm glad to do so. I've called a few admissions offices for good kids whose high schools were such that they were not getting the guidance counseling that is routine at wealthier schools. I expect to be writing more than a few letters of recommendation for scholarships this year and next.

In short, the question is not as simple as "sports vs. Scouts." A kid who is playing on a soccer team (usually midddle class or better) is in a whole different situation than a poor kid who is pouring all his effort into "getting noticed" for a pro career.

[spl08]

We have many scouts who think that they have to choose either sports or scouts if they are going to be successful in one. I noticed that most of our Eagle Scouts participate and excel in not only scouting, but also in sports.

Exactly! If you learn time managment skills, it is most certainly possible to do both all throughout the year. I've been in at least 2 sports every year in high school, and I've still found time to be active in scouting.

[spl08]

Yes, we do have cadets do pushups if they are not following rules.

In Civil Air Patrol, it's against our regulations to do that! But, despite that, it is done in some places such as Texas. I really don't know where to stand on the push ups for punishment issue. I see the advantages and disadvantages for both. Maybe just in rare situations?

Scouting and JROTC share a common purpose that is to motivate young people to become better citizens.

And Civil Air Patrol!

[tdfoxsr736]

Both of my sons compete in soccer year round, and the youngest also plays baseball. Boys can do both scouts and sports. I would rather have a boy miss some meetings to compete in sports, than to not show up at all because of sports. We stress that from the start in our troop. I find scouting makes them better athletes, and team players.

[Chief J]

We have many scouts who think that they have to choose either sports or scouts if they are going to be successful in one. I noticed that most of our Eagle Scouts participate and excel in not only scouting, but also in sports.

Exactly! If you learn time managment skills, it is most certainly possible to do both all throughout the year. I've been in at least 2 sports every year in high school, and I've still found time to be active in scouting.

I agree, I have two scouts in my Troop on the cusp of Eagle, one is 15 and the other 16. Both of these young men have been involved in Scouting since 1st grade (Tigers) and both play multiple sports during the school year, and before high school played multiple sports in the borough recreation leagues. Additionally, they both are consistantly among those few students on the High Honor Role (3.76 GPA and above) in school each semester.

Though they are quite busy, they attempt to manage their time well, and have learned the valuable skill of prioritizing their tasks. Yes at times they cannot make a scout meeting, or other function, but they do attempt to stay as involved as much as possible because they enjoy the activities we schedule.

A well planned, exciting, focused program, will keep these kids involved and make for a strong Troop.

Best Regards,
Chief J

[mhjacobson]

Yes, my troop has expereinced the conflit between sports and scouting as some of our scouts often miss meetings and campouts because of their game schedule, and yet, the boys remain in scouting and continue to advance. The secrets:

1) we try to get the game schedules when doing the annual program planning in a attempt to minimize the conflicts;

2) we try to contact the scout, one way or another, to keep him in the loop as to what he missed when he could not attend so that he keeps current;

3) we make special effort to bring in the scout at alternative times (of course following youth protection) to meet with a unit leader so that he continues to advance.

4) we try to make special arrangements to transport the scout to a campout, when necessary (one time we actually arranged for a scout to return home from another state on a Saturday evening, in order to all ow him to particiapte in a Sunday sport activity.

The result: most of the scouts remain active throughout their high school year, while engaging in both scouting and sports.