Ok, I have a new issue to an old problem..

[Hubert]

Ok, I know I have had a problem with this scout before, and have asked about it, but a new problem has come up.

This scout, along with a lot of others, were harassing another boy. I myslef was included, I am not proud of it, and have apologized and explained what happned to the person who was being harassed and to him family. But, back on topic, this scout used language that I dont think anyone should use. He is running for Eagle Scout, and these two words came from his mouth. I will not say what they are, lets just say that one is a horrible word and I think no one should use it, and the other is a cut down on ****. I heard him say that and I was greatly offended. We have all been talked to, however, it again goes to the point of representing, I do not wish to be represented by someone who uses such language. I also do not think my troop should be represented in such a manor. Hes a leader in the troop, and uses that language? Why? How come that when I bring it up nothing gets done? I just get told that the adults will talk to him, well, talking has done nothing, the acions are still being done. I am a scout, a minor, and taking it to council would only make maters worse due to my age. I wich the best for my troop, and for this boy, but I do NOT wish to be represented by a person who uses that language.

Well, again, I am sorry all for ranting, its been a rough week.

Edited by: RWSmith

[RWSmith]

Hubert,

We are all human... Even Eagle Scouts. By all means, express your concerns with your fellow Scout -- privately, respectfully, frankly.

[ASM-142]

Hubert,

As other scouts may not like to have you represent them as an Eagle Scout because of your behavior does not mean you should not be an Eagle Scout. IMHO you should not be judging other people bu be the best scout you can for your troop.

[jr56]

I agree, let the boy know privately how you feel, but don't let his actions, or lack of, determine yours.

[Nuts4Scouts]

Hubert, have you considered that the boy you harassed might not think that you are Eagle material? That he might not think that you deserve to be a JASM?

Have you considered that the boy you harassed might think your apology is not worth the air you took to give it? That if you could treat another person the way you did, that you should not be "representing" your Troop, or even Scouting at all, in any capacity.

I have a feeling that your outrage at the other Scout's language is, in part, caused by guilt over what you did. Just something to think about, trashing this kid will not make folks forget your part in the incident. It will not make what you did go away.

Let this boy know, privately, how you feel about his language. Then do your best to clean up your own act and prove to the other boys in the Troop they can trust you.

[bluenote]

Justin-

I think you should get in touch with EPF, Nick and myself and we'll go run a couple dozen rounds through our Mosin-Nagants!! A guaranteed way for everyone to feel better!

[scouter01]

i ment to edit my post once i reread it, but it didn't happen oops.

[Quailman]

Reread the first post. It's a bit hard to follow, but I think it was not the victim of harassment, but fellow perpetrator who used the colorful language. i think the harassment was incidental to the story.

[FrankJ]

In fairness to Hubert, I think he is guilty of poor grammar. 'This scout' refers to one of the scouts, whom along with Hubert, was harassing another boy.


Whether or not 'this scout' has sufficient scout spirit to earn the eagle rank is a decision for the SM and the BOR. The only thing you can do is let them know about the behavior & accept that they will make their decision all the factors and not on just one instance.

[Hubert]

OK, I know I was harrassing, I know that, I admit it, but in no case, should an Eagle Scout use such language. I am mad at myself, I know it was wrong.

But, if you read the origional post, I have talked to the scout who was harassing, I have taken it to the scoutmaster, but nothing is done. His actions still continue. This is what happens when I talk, people just rag on me for it, I understand I was wrong, I admit it, but, no example was set by either of us, however I do not feel that our Eagle Scout canidate should use such bad language in front of the boys.

So, before you pound me into the dirt with comments this time, ask yourself this, what would you do if you were here in my case? Where everything you do to try to improve the problem, gets blown up? That when you try to make it better, things never go right? If one of your own Eagle Scout Canidates did this?

Ive done everything you all have sugested, but nothing has worked. I am not just judging him by this incident, there are plenty of other incidents with this young man, I just wish for him to act like an Eagle Scout. I know there is no real outline for what an Eagle Scout should be, but, I do know that they set an example for the rest of the troop.

I know i am just a teen, I understand that...but, I am about honor, pride, and respect. Useing that language looses respect from me. Its not this incident either, there are plenty of other problems this boy has been apart of.

I am not trying to rag on him or anything, I just wish for assistance on what to do, since nothing has worked.

[Name deleted]- Ive burned through some! And man do I feel better!

Edited by: RWSmith

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[spl08]

OK, I know I was harrassing, I know that, I admit it, but in no case, should an Eagle Scout use such language. I am mad at myself, I know it was wrong.

Didn't you make this pretty clear in your original post??? It surprises me that some are almost reeming on you for something you said you cleared up and apologized for.

...I do not feel that our Eagle Scout canidate should use such bad language in front of the boys.

Yes, that is true. Why do these kind of issues come up when scouts are going for Eagle? Overall, why is this tollerated when going for ANY rank in any troop?

what would you do if you were here in my case? Where everything you do to try to improve the problem, gets blown up? That when you try to make it better, things never go right? If one of your own Eagle Scout Canidates did this?

First, I would take the candidate asside and calmly, professionally, and ever so slightly authoritativly discuss this with him and tell him that you better never see this again. If you've already done this, and the problem persists, and adult leaders really won't do anything about the situation I personally would take this to the next level. This scout obviously doesn't seem to show a disire to improve himself so upon noticing the offence again, (unless I were teaching a class or something), I would take him outside where I couldn't be heard (praise in public, critisize in private), and I would reem the living heck out of him. I would say things like:

"So you think it's fun making fun of your fellow scouts? doesn't seem like a very scout like thing to do now does it? Tell me right now, what is the scout law? (after the scout tells me) So where exactly does making fun of a fellow scout fit in there? Doesn't sound very friendly to me, doesn't sound very kind, cheerful, clean or reverent so how exaclty does this fit in hmm? That's right it doesn't fit in anywhere!!! So are you just going to keep doing this? What if this scout drops out because he was made fun of? Do you feel like being responsible for that? I'm sure the council would love to here this about when considering you for Eagle. And how do you think that make Eagles look? Keep in mind, when you where that badge and medal, your not just representing what is supposedly you, your representing EVERYBODY who has EVER become an Eagle and worn the scout uniform! If you don't think that's something important to represent well, then you need to rethink becoming an Eagle or even being involved in scouting. Your a Life Scout; you already represent some of the best that scouting can offer. There's no excuse for this at all. Now are you going to change this, or do I have to go all the way up to the scoutmaster with it? (even though the SM may not have done anything with it before, if the scout doesn't know that, the statement can be a major intimidation factor which may aide in stopping the behavior). As a final thought to keep in mind, if you keep doing this, I will personally take the scout with me to the scoutmaster to explain the situation (which would be a good a idea before doing any of this to begin with), and then ask the scout to leave to request that you not be signed off for Eagle. Now lets go back inside and see how truely dedicated you are as scout"

If he's already been signed off by the SM, ignore most of the last part and just skip from "no excuse for this at all" to "go back inside."

I know there is no real outline for what an Eagle Scout should be...

Scout Oath and Law.

...but, I am about honor, pride, and respect. Useing that language looses respect from me. Its not this incident either, there are plenty of other problems this boy has been apart of.

Then I would highly suggest doing what I mentioned above. Though it is the method we should generally avoid in scouting, it is in rare cases neccessary.

[Hubert]

Thank you SPL08, thats what I was hoping someone would do! Thank you again! I will talk to him at our next meeting, and I hope it works!

[pipestone1991]

You know, I got a three-month probation from getting Eagle and it was only because I admitedly was a little immature. I never "harrased" anyone. I am up for Eagle in a week, now if your "harrasment" was so severe that you had to talk tothe scout's parents, then you are lucky you are still an Eagle candidate.

[Nuts4Scouts]

What most of us are trying to tell you is that disciplining this Scout is not YOUR call. Weather or not this Scout makes Eagle is not YOUR call.

You might have some influence on weather or not he stays in a leadership position, if that position is an elected one. Otherwise, relieving him of his POR is not YOUR call.

If his behavior is as bad as you state then it is a good bet that the adults in your Troop have noticed it too. You have told the Troop adults about this. They have told you they are aware of it. It is now up to your SM.

About the only thing you can do is to make sure you let your SPL and your SM know every time this Scout uses language that offends you. You should get any other Scout who hears this to go to the SPL and SM also.


I realize that you feel picked on, and do not think this is important, but in my opinion, if I was the Scout you and your buddies had harassed, you could all apologize until you turned blue. I might have to be polite and take it for the sake of the Troop, but I would have a real hard time ever trusting you, or any of the others, again. On a scale of the offensive, having to listen to swearing would not rate as high to me as not being able to trust my fellow Scouts.

Something to think about.

[spl08]

If his behavior is as bad as you state then it is a good bet that the adults in your Troop have noticed it too. You have told the Troop adults about this. They have told you they are aware of it. It is now up to your SM.

But if the SM has already been told, and other adults have already been told numerous times and still done NOTHING about it, and everybody else has still done NOTHING about it, should Hubert simply be expected to just let it go? I would think that would be against the integrity of any true scout.

About the only thing you can do is to make sure you let your SPL and your SM know every time this Scout uses language that offends you. You should get any other Scout who hears this to go to the SPL and SM also.

I might be wrong here, but as a JASM, doesn't he have some authority to handle the situation as well?

On a scale of the offensive, having to listen to swearing would not rate as high to me as not being able to trust my fellow Scouts.

If I understand this correctly, it's not just that a couple of scouts who are friends are just joking around and pop a little cussing around when talking to each other and a scout just standing to the side hears it. This scout was being mocked by the older ones.

I realize that you feel picked on, and do not think this is important, but in my opinion, if I was the Scout you and your buddies had harassed, you could all apologize until you turned blue...

If I got a sincere apology, I think I'd be able to trust them. And I think most other scouts would too in this situation. Of course, that requires a sincere apology, which isn't always guarenteed.

[ASM-142]

If I understand this correctly, it's not just that a couple of scouts who are friends are just joking around and pop a little cussing around when talking to each other and a scout just standing to the side hears it. This scout was being mocked by the older ones.

This was my understanding as well with one of the older scouts being Hubert (the JASM).

The saying goes is you live in glass houses don't throw stones.

[maricopasem]

So, before you pound me into the dirt with comments this time, ask yourself this, what would you do if you were here in my case?

If I were you I would spend time and effort trying to improve myself rather than worry so much about this other young man. I agree with previous posters who view your actions as more serious than the profanity. To have the JASM lead a group of "a lot of other" Scouts in harassing and mocking another boy is unconscionable.

Perhaps one of the reasons the adult leaders and your fellow Scouts don't respond to your concerns like you think they should is because of poor choices like this.

I know i am just a teen, I understand that...but, I am about honor, pride, and respect.

Can you see how this statement might sound a little hollow and hypocritical under the circumstances?

I suggest you do all you can to improve yourself. Reassert yourself as a leader through consistent proper choices. Become a true leader: one who other boys want to follow because of your character and integrity and kindness, as opposed to one who has to prod and threaten and tattle.

[Hubert]

So, before you pound me into the dirt with comments this time, ask yourself this, what would you do if you were here in my case?

If I were you I would spend time and effort trying to improve myself rather than worry so much about this other young man. I agree with previous posters who view your actions as more serious than the profanity. To have the JASM lead a group of "a lot of other" Scouts in harassing and mocking another boy is unconscionable.

Perhaps one of the reasons the adult leaders and your fellow Scouts don't respond to your concerns like you think they should is because of poor choices like this.

I know i am just a teen, I understand that...but, I am about honor, pride, and respect.

Can you see how this statement might sound a little hollow and hypocritical under the circumstances?

I suggest you do all you can to improve yourself. Reassert yourself as a leader through consistent proper choices. Become a true leader: one who other boys want to follow because of your character and integrity and kindness, as opposed to one who has to prod and threaten and tattle.

OK! I GET IT. I MESSED UP. I TALKED TO HIM AND HIS FAMILY ALREADY AND WORKED IT OUT. I KNOW I MADE A MISTAKE, BUT IN NO WAY DID I EVER SAY THAT WORD OR PHRASE.

No where is my posts did I say I was leading in the teasing, I said I was involved, please dont jump to conclusions, or assume that because Im the oldest, I led the teasing.

Im sorry for the outburst, but thats the only response I have got, other than SPL08, is just people slamming me. I know teasing is not right, but I also do not think an older scout should use that kind of profanity in front of the younger boys. All I wanted was to know what to do, not for everyone to slam on me. If I wanted to be slammed Id just go elsewhere, I do not need that here.

[ASM-142]

You are the JASM. You should of stopped this and not participated at all. It is hypercritcal of you to condone another scout when you are also to blame.

An apology only goes so far. You admit that to apologized to this specific scout. However, you need to apologize to your troop who witnessed this since you let them down.

[Hubert]

You are the JASM. You should of stopped this and not participated at all. It is hypercritcal of you to condone another scout when you are also to blame.

An apology only goes so far. You admit that to apologized to this specific scout. However, you need to apologize to your troop who witnessed this since you let them down.

What about the scoutmaster and Asst. Scoutmasters? They were involved a well...so now what?