Merit Badge procedures

[ringo885]

What do you do if scouts contact a merit badge counselor, before contacting the Scoutmaster? I recently had 2 scouts come up to me and ask for a blue card, and I never even spoke to them before hand. I don't know how they found the counselor. I don't like people in our troop sneaking behind the scenes. I try to keep everything out in the open at all times.

[wagionvigil]

welcome to the forum. As to your question, Nothing. If you search blue cards using the search part of the forum you will find some discussions about this subject. I would copy the MBC list and give a copy to all of the scouts in my troop.

[RWSmith]

Following on Wagionvigil's comment...

First, welcome to the forums.

Second, use the search feature (since you're new here) to find a wealth of past discussions.

Third, re your question: several past editions, and the current edition, of the ACP&P do not "require" a Scout to get permission from the SM to take a MB. I.e., while it may be a regular practice in many Troops, getting a BC from the SM "first", before starting a MB, is not a requirement, nor is it behind-the-back behavior. (If a Scout is savvy enough to know the actual rules and policies better than the ULs, I say, more power to him. )

NOTE: However, the current ACP&P will become obsolete and replaced next week with the new (renamed) and well-revised Guide To Advancement (GTA). smtroop168, who was involved in the rewrite, has hinted to us here that this pesky "BC thingy" will be definitely "resolved" once the GTA is released.

[smtroop168]

NOTE: However, the current ACP&P will become obsolete and replaced next week with the new (renamed) and well-revised Advancement Policies and Procedures (APP). smtroop168, who was involved in the rewrite, has hinted to us here that this pesky "BC thingy" will be definitely "resolved" once the APP is released.[/list]

Although some would say this has always been the case, it will be in black and white in the "Guide to Advancement" due out shortly.

Unit Leader Signs the Application for Merit Badge (“Blue Card”) Though a few merit badges may have certain restrictions, any Scout may work on any one of them at any time; up until he turns 18 – if he has the approval of his unit leader. This is indicated by his or her signature on form #34124, Application for Merit Badge, commonly called “The Blue Card.” Though it is the responsibility of a Scoutmaster for example, to see that a counselor is found and made available, the Scout may have one in mind with whom he would like to work. This is acceptable, but the unit leader should still consider the recommendation and approve it if it is appropriate.


The bigger concern from me is the "sneaking around comment". The MBC list is public knowledge here so any scout can see who is a counselor. If they jumped the gun, don't beat them up, just explain how the procedure is supposed to work.

[ScoutMomGWRC]

What do you do if scouts contact a merit badge counselor, before contacting the Scoutmaster? I recently had 2 scouts come up to me and ask for a blue card, and I never even spoke to them before hand. I don't know how they found the counselor. I don't like people in our troop sneaking behind the scenes. I try to keep everything out in the open at all times.

I was just curious if you asked the scouts how they found the merit badge counselor. My son is in one troop and his best friend is in another. I am a counselor for 2 Eagle required badges and through every day discussion, my son's friend found out that I was. He asked if I would work with him on one of them. I directed him to get a blue card, but as you can see it seems to be almost the same situation. This scout would approach his SM after talking to me... but there is no sneaking around or trying to do something without approval.

[AquilaNegra2]

Is it sneaking around? Or was it simply an opportunity they had to begin working on the badge? Use it as an educational opportunity - to spell out to them how you'd like merit badges to be handled.

The soon-to-be guide concerns me somewhat. What about SMs who think Scouts aren't ready to work on badges until 1st class, and therefore won't approve any until then? Scouts are just SOL?

[wagionvigil]

Is it sneaking around? Or was it simply an opportunity they had to begin working on the badge? Use it as an educational opportunity - to spell out to them how you'd like merit badges to be handled.

The soon-to-be guide concerns me somewhat. What about SMs who think Scouts aren't ready to work on badges until 1st class, and therefore won't approve any until then? Scouts are just SOL?

These Scoutmasters should be concerned that the keep their position

[AquilaNegra2]

Agreed, Wagion, but I've run into more than one of them. My concern is that requiring a SMer's signature to begin will retard some Scouts' progress. The blue card is just a record-keeping tool, anyway. Is it now going to be required?

[wagionvigil]

Agreed, Wagion, but I've run into more than one of them. My concern is that requiring a SMer's signature to begin will retard some Scouts' progress. The blue card is just a record-keeping tool, anyway. Is it now going to be required?

You are correct about record keeping and in the Past Adv Policies and Procedeurs they were not required.
Oh here is a good one. I did a Music MB for two young men a couple of weeks ago and heard today that the advancement chair of their Troop would not accept them because i had failed to fill them in properly. you know Name Address Tel # and All the requirements checked off, When I do a MB a one time I sign it and date it. Everyone at Council knows me. Even for out of council Troops I sign and Date and Tel # that is It. And X the Requirement section.

[smtroop168]

Agreed, Wagion, but I've run into more than one of them. My concern is that requiring a SMer's signature to begin will retard some Scouts' progress. The blue card is just a record-keeping tool, anyway. Is it now going to be required?

You are correct about record keeping and in the Past Adv Policies and Procedeurs they were not required.
Oh here is a good one. I did a Music MB for two young men a couple of weeks ago and heard today that the advancement chair of their Troop would not accept them because i had failed to fill them in properly. you know Name Address Tel # and All the requirements checked off, When I do a MB a one time I sign it and date it. Everyone at Council knows me. Even for out of council Troops I sign and Date and Tel # that is It. And X the Requirement section.

Blue Cards have always been required and is the nationally recognized merit badge record. The older ACPP refers readers to the BSA requirements book that comes out annually which says use the BSA Form #34124, Application for Merit Badge,. The BC has been updated from time to time and carries the information needed for proper posting and for evidence and reference as needed later. Units, districts and councils do not have the authority to implement a different system for merit badge approval and documentation. For very large events – such as the National Scout Jamboree – the National Council may approve a more efficient format and sizing for the blue card. This is done through the National Advancement Team.


AN2...Send me some units that you believe are not following procedures offline and also what they use for a substitute BC.

[wagionvigil]

several years ago at the cave we were seeing many from central region that their councils were NOT using Blue Cards they were using a sheet with name etc on the sheet like a training sheet for adults. But recently not seeing it as much. I always keep a big stack on my desk at the cave just in case.

[Mrw]

Oh here is a good one. I did a Music MB for two young men a couple of weeks ago and heard today that the advancement chair of their Troop would not accept them because i had failed to fill them in properly. you know Name Address Tel # and All the requirements checked off, When I do a MB a one time I sign it and date it. Everyone at Council knows me. Even for out of council Troops I sign and Date and Tel # that is It. And X the Requirement section.

I was asked recently about a blue card being valid if the requirements section was not fully filled out. My reply was that as long as the MBC had signed it, it was considered complete.

[agdparker]

We get forms back from Scout camp sometimes that are not BC's, but just a grid showing the boys name, the MB and the date they were completed. These are accepted by our council office, but I can't speak to as to whether or not they are correctly doing this.

[wagionvigil]

Matt I am looking for My syllabus where it states that Blue Cards Are a Book keeping article between the Scout and Counselor and are not required to take a MB. This goes back about 5 or 6 years I believe

[smtroop168]

We get forms back from Scout camp sometimes that are not BC's, but just a grid showing the boys name, the MB and the date they were completed. These are accepted by our council office, but I can't speak to as to whether or not they are correctly doing this.

Matt I am looking for My syllabus where it states that Blue Cards Are a Book keeping article between the Scout and Counselor and are not required to take a MB. This goes back about 5 or 6 years I believe

Just quoting the new book...I am under no illusion that people follow the correct procedures.

[bnelso]

Well, so much for the new book answering all the questions and stopping the debates

[FrankJ]

Sort of in the same topic.

I noticed on the national web site that the Bass Pro shops are going to have merit badge clinics with a supply of blue cards on hand. I guess that bypasses the step one of talk to your SM, get a signed blue card & the name of a merit badge councilor. Kind of hard to insist on policy when national ignores it.

No opinion yet on the Bass Pro shop promotion. That should be a separate thread anyway.

The new book will not become policy until it is actually published.

[bnelso]

Bass Pro did this last year too. Not sure how many years they have been doing it.

Supposedly, the Scout is suppose to talk to their Scoutmaster 1st and get permission to take the class there. The way it probably works is that Mom or Dad sees the advertisement and takes their son down for the class. Since Bass Pro knows it would be bad business to turn the Scout away, they have the blue cards ready.

[wagionvigil]

OT but I know that several Bass pro Shops are used for BSA pistol training so they are a big BSA Presence

[smtroop168]

Sort of in the same topic.

I noticed on the national web site that the Bass Pro shops are going to have merit badge clinics with a supply of blue cards on hand. I guess that bypasses the step one of talk to your SM, get a signed blue card & the name of a merit badge councilor. Kind of hard to insist on policy when national ignores it.

No opinion yet on the Bass Pro shop promotion. That should be a separate thread anyway.

The new book will not become policy until it is actually published.

Here's an example of a Bass Pro shop event. Notice that they must be preregistered...so they should be able to get a BC before they go. http://www.lhcbsa.org/Story.cfm?STID=15

You are correct about when the new book becomes policy...the decision on the effective date is being made this week.