Activity Requirement for 2nd and 1st class

[AndrewMcHorney]

Hi:

I have a question which concerns what defines a troop activity for 2nd class and 1st class. Our troop defines an activity as an event in which a tour permit was obtained and permission slips were signed. This made sure we were covered insurance wise. We have a new Scoutmaster who came from a troop where an activity was defined as any event that happened. What is the proper definition? We do not have a problem with Scouts meeting the activity requirement using the tour permit and permission slip method.

Thanks,
Andrew

[ASM-142]

The actual requirement is troop/patrol activities. A patrol activity certainly does not require a permit and I am sure that there are troop activities that do not as well. For example, this coming Saturday, the scouts from my troop are meeting at a local cemetery to place US Flags on veteran's graves. This cemetery is in our town and everyone is transporting themselves. For this troop activity there is no tour permit.

[Buffalo Bill]

The need for a tour permit is determined by your local Council. Some publish guidelines such as these:

SOME EXAMPLES OF WHEN A TOUR PERMIT SHOULD BE FILED
All trips or outings outside of the home community of the unit.
Any activities that involves an overnight stay.
Any activity that includes a small number of adults responsible for the transportation of a greater number of youth. In other words, the parents are not directly responsible for the transportation of their own children to and from an activity.
An event that requires special skilled leadership; i.e. swimming, shooting sports, boating, rappelling, climbing, etc.

SOME EXAMPLES IN WHICH A TOUR PERMIT IS NOT REQUIRED
Participating in an event or activity that involves minimal risk, within a unit’s hometown, when parents are transporting their sons and Scouting neighbors.
Participating at an activity in which the Scout is participating as an individual, accompanied by a parent or guardian, and not with the unit.

Some Councils allow units to attend District or Council events without a permit. However, this is not always the case. Tour permits help document that a leader is YOUTH PROTECTION trained. Local Council policies may now require YPT documentation for every activity. I know of one Council that requires a LTP even if parents drive their own children.

ASM-142's activity falls within his council's policy for not needing a Tour permit. We plan on doing the same type of activity on Memorial Day with no tour permit filed. You may find that some of your activities may not need an LTP. Your council may publish its policy on its web site.

Best bet, talk with your Unit Commissioner, or the folks at the Council office, to ensure you file when needed.

[AndrewMcHorney]

Hi

The question is not when we should filel a permit but when does something count as an activity. There have been only a couple of activities where we did not file a permit because transporation was not involved and perhaps there was not enough time to do it.

Under the previous Scoutmaster, if the troop did something then a permit had to be filed and permission slips signed.

It is interesting to note that Troopmaster allows an ectivity to be created and marked as not counting towards the 1st and 2nd class requirements.

Andrew

[Lynda J]

Our troop had a car wash this past Saturday. It is a Troop Activity. Did we need a tour permit. No. Parents dropped the kids off at the site and picked them back up. . We also went to a City Council Meeting. The boys were dropped off and picked up by parents. It is still a troop activity. But since they were planned by the troop and almost all the boys took part they are troop activity

[ASM-142]

For the most part a patrol activities does not need a tour permit and would count as an activity towards 2nd and 1st class.

Troop activites may or may not need a tour permit but either way they would count as an activity towards 2nd and 1st class.

[Hamish17]

"Since joining, have participated in five separate troop/patrol activities (other than troop/patrol meetings), two of which included camping overnight." (for Second Class)

The apparrent definition in our troop is something that is offered to be done as a troop, with at least two deep leadership, outside of the scheduled troop or patrol meeting time. Some examples would be: campout, overnight, trip to a museum, bike ride, canoeing, trip to a sporting event, swimoree, hike, backpacking or skiing.

[ASM-142]

"Since joining, have participated in five separate troop/patrol activities (other than troop/patrol meetings), two of which included camping overnight." (for Second Class)

The apparrent definition in our troop is something that is offered to be done as a troop, with at least two deep leadership, outside of the scheduled troop or patrol meeting time. Some examples would be: campout, overnight, trip to a museum, bike ride, canoeing, trip to a sporting event, swimoree, hike, backpacking or skiing.

A patrol activity should count for this requirement and does not need adult leadership.

[Scouting179]

This is another case where the guidelines from National are vague and open to wide unit-level intrepretation. There is no clearly defined set of rules.

[ASM-142]

This is one area where I do not think that the requirments are vague. The requirement states "troop/patrol activities". It does not state only troop activities that require tour permits and permission slips. Not does it state tat these activities require two deep leadership.

[Scouting179]

It all depends on what you call an activity. Is a troop meeting an activity? A Court of Honor?

[Buffalo Bill]

I think, for the purposes of advancement, the HB is fairly specific that a troop meeting or patrol meeting does not count:

"Since joining, have participated in five separate troop/patrol activities (other than troop/patrol meetings), two of which included camping overnight." (from the Second Class requirements)

"Since joining, have participated in 10 separate troop/patrol activities (other than troop/patrol meetings), three of which included camping overnight." (from First Class requirements)

Since CoH is not mentioned, it should count.

I posted some Council's requirements for LTPs earlier in this thread. Whether or not an LTP is needed is best determined by reviewing your local Council's policies.

[scoutchallenge]

Also, in our troop I would not count the Court of Honor. With rare Eagle exceptions, all of ours are durning the time that meetings are normally held. So I would count this as a meeting.

[Buffalo Bill]

Perfectly valid assumption. I imagine you would count it if it were on a different night though.

[ASM-142]

On a different night providing that the normal troop meeting is not being "re-scheduled" for that activity (i.e., the troop meeting goes on as planned for that week)

[scoutchallenge]

Hey I must have missed the "Submit" button on my post befor my last post.

I think that every event that the boys participate in should count. That would include planting the flags, a car wash, saturday clean up at a community event, Eagle Project help, and COH that is held NOT duting regular meetings. The scouts need to be recognized for showing up to all events or they will only not understand that they need to attend all events.